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Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 5:01 pm
by idpickering
"Dividends on B Shares will be paid, by default, in pounds sterling at the rate of 37.16p per B Share. Holders of B Shares who have validly submitted euro currency elections by November 25, 2016 will be entitled to a dividend of €0.4413 per B Share.
This dividend will be payable on December 16, 2016 to those members whose names were on the Register of Members on November 11, 2016."
http://www.investegate.co.uk/royal-dutc ... 3746PD7B8/
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 6:50 pm
by tjh290633
Thanks, Ian. I had forgotten that would be announced today.
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 7:24 pm
by Breelander
I'd forgotten too, thanks.
(I'd have given you a Rec for this in 'the old country' rather than clutter up this thread
)
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 7:36 pm
by 77ss
idpickering wrote:"Dividends on B Shares will be paid, by default, in pounds sterling at the rate of 37.16p per B Share.
A pleasing 19.6% increase over last year's 31.07p. I suppose this will reverse at some stage, but for now it feels good.
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 7:48 pm
by Breelander
77ss wrote: A pleasing 19.6% increase over last year's 31.07p. I suppose this will reverse at some stage, but for now it feels good.
Until the next time you fill your car's tank at the local garage. The oil used to make your fuel is also priced in dollars. This time last year a litre of unleaded was 102.9 round my way, it's 114.9 today - an 11.7% rise
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 7:57 pm
by Breelander
Breelander wrote:77ss wrote: A pleasing 19.6% increase over last year's 31.07p. I suppose this will reverse at some stage, but for now it feels good.
Until the next time you fill your car's tank at the local garage. The oil used to make your fuel is also priced in dollars. This time last year a litre of unleaded was 102.9 round my way (soon to drop to 99.9p by the end of the year), it's 114.9 today - an 11.7% rise
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 9:32 pm
by 77ss
Breelander wrote:Until the next time you fill your car's tank at the local garage
I don't run a car!
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 10:20 pm
by Breelander
77ss wrote:I don't run a car!
You sill pay for fuel - some to run public transport and some transports your food to the shops. Do you heat your home with gas? That's priced in dollars too and follows the oil prices, and we import 55% of it.
We also import 38% of the gas we use via pipelines from Europe and Norway. The remaining 17% comes in to the UK by tankers in the form of Liquefied Natural Gas (LNG).
https://www.britishgas.co.uk/the-source ... -come-from
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 10:35 pm
by Gengulphus
Breelander wrote:77ss wrote: A pleasing 19.6% increase over last year's 31.07p. I suppose this will reverse at some stage, but for now it feels good.
Until the next time you fill your car's tank at the local garage. The oil used to make your fuel is also priced in dollars. This time last year a litre of unleaded was 102.9 round my way, it's 114.9 today - an 11.7% rise
I reckon a 19.6% increase in income accompanied by an 11.7% rise in outgoings will still feel good... ;
-)
Of course, it's really 19.6% of a fraction F1 of your income and 11.7% of a fraction F2 of your outgoings: if F2 is sufficiently bigger than F1, it might not feel quite so good... Which is one of the reasons why its a good idea for HYPs to diversify into oil & gas producers when the opportunity arises: even when they fall, there's the consolation prize that one's fuel bills are probably also falling...
Gengulphus
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 2nd, 2016, 10:50 pm
by Deev8
Thanks Ian - the conversion rates for dividends declared in other currencies are the announcements that I frequently miss.
Dave
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 3rd, 2016, 11:20 am
by Julian
And for all the people who forget about the divi conversion dates - remember to pay attention in a few days time, this coming Tuesday 6th December, because that is the date that BP announces its sterling conversion rate for its 16th December divi payout. I'm sure Ian will be on the case though
.
- Julian
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 3rd, 2016, 5:04 pm
by idpickering
Julian wrote:And for all the people who forget about the divi conversion dates - remember to pay attention in a few days time, this coming Tuesday 6th December, because that is the date that BP announces its sterling conversion rate for its 16th December divi payout. I'm sure Ian will be on the case though
.
- Julian
Hi Julian,
I'm afraid I'll have to pass the baton on that one, as I'll be in bed on the publication of announcement, having been working the previous night! LOL
Ian.
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 3rd, 2016, 10:01 pm
by BigPic
I bought Shell at a number of different prices in recent years. The cheaper end of these is approaching a 10% yield with these currency adjustments. Never thought I'd see Shell deliver those returns other than after many years of small increases.
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 10:23 am
by idpickering
BigPic wrote:I bought Shell at a number of different prices in recent years. The cheaper end of these is approaching a 10% yield with these currency adjustments. Never thought I'd see Shell deliver those returns other than after many years of small increases.
They say, "never sell Shell" apparently. Although I've trimmed back over the years, and bought more, they have been a mainstay of my HYP from the outset.
Ian.
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 10:52 am
by tjh290633
By the way, the equivalent announcement from BP. is due on Tuesday, I believe.
TJH
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 12:32 pm
by idpickering
tjh290633 wrote:By the way, the equivalent announcement from BP. is due on Tuesday, I believe.
TJH
That is correct Terry;
"Sterling cash dividend per ordinary share announcement date - 06-Dec-16"
http://www.bp.com/en/global/corporate/i ... dends.html
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 2:52 pm
by bjmarren
Hi All,
I'm in the process of compiling a HYP portfolio of candidates and Shell is a part of it. However, I'm non-resident for tax purposes as regards the UK, as I live in Bulgaria, and assume it is the A shares I should be looking at rather than the B category despite the 15% with-holding tax on the category A shares. Are there any other Hypers in the same situation regarding Shell and is there anything else I should be aware of regarding the tax issue?
Thanks in advance,
Brendan
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 4:03 pm
by bjmarren
Hi again,
Having searched around on the web it seems its simply up to me as to whether I choose to buy category A or B depending on which is beneficial to me tax wise. At Friday's closing prices it makes more sense to buy category B.
Brendan
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 5:52 pm
by tjh290633
bjmarren wrote:I'm in the process of compiling a HYP portfolio of candidates and Shell is a part of it. However, I'm non-resident for tax purposes as regards the UK, as I live in Bulgaria, and assume it is the A shares I should be looking at rather than the B category despite the 15% with-holding tax on the category A shares. Are there any other Hypers in the same situation regarding Shell and is there anything else I should be aware of regarding the tax issue?
Not necessarily. You can elect to be paid in €uros if you hold RDSB, and so avoid the Dutch withholding tax.
TJH
Re: Shell Sterling Divi
Posted: December 4th, 2016, 7:13 pm
by Gengulphus
tjh290633 wrote:bjmarren wrote:I'm in the process of compiling a HYP portfolio of candidates and Shell is a part of it. However, I'm non-resident for tax purposes as regards the UK, as I live in Bulgaria, and assume it is the A shares I should be looking at rather than the B category despite the 15% with-holding tax on the category A shares. Are there any other Hypers in the same situation regarding Shell and is there anything else I should be aware of regarding the tax issue?
Not necessarily. You can elect to be paid in €uros if you hold RDSB, and so avoid the Dutch withholding tax.
You can, but the real taxation issue here is a Bulgarian one: how do the Bulgarian tax authorities tax you on RDSA dividends (paid under the tax system of the Netherlands, which has a 15% withholding tax on dividends) and on RDSB dividends (paid under the tax system of the UK, which has no withholding tax on dividends). I believe the usual arrangement is that the country under whose tax system the dividend is paid can charge a withholding tax, often limited by a double taxation treaty (typically to 15%), and then the country in which you are tax-resident typically calculates the tax you owe but allows you to offset the withholding tax against it - but only down to zero: if the withholding tax is more than the tax you owe, it doesn't become negative tax that the taxman owes to you!
The net result is that if the tax you owe under the tax system of the country you're tax-resident in is more than the Dutch withholding tax, the choice between RDSA and RDSB only affects which country gets the tax, not how much tax you pay in total. If it's less than the Dutch withholding tax, then RDSB is better.
And generally, the currency you're paid in is only really a matter of convenience: whichever country you're tax-resident in will generally require you to translate it to the local currency for your local tax calculation. When the company sets the dividend using the exchange rate on one date and pays it on another, then you might end up being taxed on a different amount than the original declared dividend because the exchange rate moved between the two dates, but unless you want to bet on fairly short-term exchange rate movements, you're probably going to reckon the difference is just as likely to work against you as in your favour.
BUT all of that is general rules, to which there are many exceptions. What's needed here is someone knowledgeable about Bulgarian taxation of foreign dividends - and I'm afraid I'm not that someone! Nor do I know anyone who is, so all I can do say that's the type of person who is needed...
Gengulphus