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Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 5th, 2024, 10:46 pm
by Mike4
Beerpig wrote:Reading about the latest scandal to hit Westminster, you do wonder how thick some MPs are?
It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
<Tin hat on>
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 5th, 2024, 10:48 pm
by Mike4
terminal7 wrote:Speaking to reporters, Mr Hunt said the reports were a "great cause for concern" but Mr Wragg had "given a courageous and fulsome apology".
Mr Wragg, who is vice chair of the 1922 committee of backbench Tory MPs, told the Times said he had sent intimate pictures of himself to a man he met on gay dating app Grindr.
"They had compromising things on me. They wouldn't leave me alone,"
Words fail me.
T7
BTW - interesting use of 'they' - answers on a postcard to the usual posters
Isn't just?!
Makes one wonder how many there were, blackmailing him.
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 6:45 am
by Leothebear
Interesting that his actions invoke sympathy from his cronies. Contrast that to someone raising concerns about the growth and influence of Islam.
Leo
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 7:47 am
by terminal7
Wragg has already declared that he is not standing at next GE - hence key objectives by the Govt are to show him as a victim, shut him up and ,of course, ensure that there is not another by-election. In any normal working environment, this would be a sacking offence.
T7
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 8:14 am
by mc2fool
Mike4 wrote:Beerpig wrote:Reading about the latest scandal to hit Westminster, you do wonder how thick some MPs are?
It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
<Tin hat on>
Plutocracy
A plutocracy (from Ancient Greek πλοῦτος (ploûtos) 'wealth', and κράτος (krátos) 'power') or plutarchy is a society that is ruled or controlled by people of great wealth or income.
:
The term plutocracy is generally used as a pejorative to describe or warn against an undesirable condition. Throughout history, political thinkers and philosophers have condemned plutocrats for ignoring their social responsibilities, using their power to serve their own purposes and thereby increasing poverty and nurturing class conflict and corrupting societies with greed and hedonism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PlutocracyHmmmm....sounds familiar anyway ...
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 10:08 am
by 88V8
Mike4 wrote:Beerpig wrote:Reading about the latest scandal to hit Westminster, you do wonder how thick some MPs are?
It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
Well, as we aren't paying them enough to attract sufficient quality candidates, it might be worth trying.
I mean, we already have a PM who doesn't need his salary. And I don't detect any tendency in him towards plutocratic leanings, so there are potential candidates out there.
V8
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 10:21 am
by UncleEbenezer
88V8 wrote:Mike4 wrote:It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
Well, as we aren't paying them enough to attract sufficient quality candidates, it might be worth trying.
I mean, we already have a PM who doesn't need his salary. And I don't detect any tendency in him towards plutocratic leanings, so there are potential candidates out there.
V8
Heh. Weren't Patrician prime ministers pretty-much the norm before Thatcher championed the Entrepreneur?
Our last (non-Lactucan) Prime Minister combined enormous wealth with extreme greed for more. As did Blair before that. And many of those who surround them, taking it to the level of short-selling Blighty quite literally with their hedge funds.
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 10:21 am
by Mike4
88V8 wrote:Mike4 wrote:It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
Well, as we aren't paying them enough to attract sufficient quality candidates, it might be worth trying.
I mean, we already have a PM who doesn't need his salary. And I don't detect any tendency in him towards plutocratic leanings, so there are potential candidates out there.
V8
Hmmm I remain to be convinced paying ever higher salaries attracts higher calibre people. Remind me, how much was Paula Vennells being paid to captain the Post Office during worst of the Horizon debacle?
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 10:59 am
by Hallucigenia
Mike4 wrote:It does strike me as one more reason to stop paying MPs a salary and generous expenses.
The calibre of candidates for parliament would surely rocket if there were no pay, and therefore only people of independent means could practically stand for election.
<Tin hat on>
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 3:01 pm
by 88V8
Hallucigenia wrote:
Prime Minister Cholmondley-Warner does have a certain ring to it.
V8
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 4:41 pm
by DrFfybes
Beerpig wrote:These people are supposed to be the nation's elected elite, our leaders.
Words fail me.
Really?
I can suggest a few if you want, but I'd probably be banned from TLF.
Even worse is that of the dozen or so of his colleagues contacted following disclosure of their phone numbers, a couple of them actually thought it a good idea to respond with photographs of themselves.
We should form the TLF party and stand in their constituencies - "We might be Fools, but at least we're not Tools."
Paul
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 6th, 2024, 8:10 pm
by moorfield
Back in the day a Tory MP's peccadillo of choice was an orange and bondage iirc, and maybe dressed in a football shirt. How times have changed!
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 7th, 2024, 9:45 am
by dealtn
didds wrote:stevensfo wrote:, but the MP's lost all dignity and self-respect for ever.
MPs actually HAVE any dignity and self-respect? Who knew?!
Have you actually met any elected politician? The vast majority (and all of the ones I have met) are engaging and genuine in trying to improve the lives of their representatives.
I guess its easy to default to a cynical position of universal criticism of motives and actions.
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 7th, 2024, 2:37 pm
by didds
dealtn wrote:didds wrote:
MPs actually HAVE any dignity and self-respect? Who knew?!
Have you actually met any elected politician? The vast majority (and all of the ones I have met) are engaging and genuine in trying to improve the lives of their representatives.
I guess its easy to default to a cynical position of universal criticism of motives and actions.
yes.
three.
one seemed very decent.
one was at best aloof.
the third - not interested in little people like me. After all I was only one of their constituents.
I'm quite happy with my very tongue in cheek, non serious portrayal. Which at least largely fits what was intended to be nothing more than a light hearted throw away clearly daft line.
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 7th, 2024, 3:36 pm
by bungeejumper
dealtn wrote:Have you actually met any elected politician? The vast majority (and all of the ones I have met) are engaging and genuine in trying to improve the lives of their representatives.
More than that, I've worked professionally with four of them. (All ministers, ex ministers or shadow ministers, both Tory and Labour.) One was pleasant, gracious and well-informed, one was from another weird planet entirely, and two were insufferable windbags who viewed the world solely through their own reflecting mirrors and who gave no impression of actually
having constituencies. Wild horses wouldn't drag their names out of me. Which is probably just as well.
BJ
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 7th, 2024, 4:03 pm
by 88V8
dealtn wrote:didds wrote:MPs actually HAVE any dignity and self-respect? Who knew?!
Have you actually met any elected politician?
I met Kwarteng back in 2010 when he was canvassing for election.
Instantly impressive. I recall saying to my wife "he could be our first black PM".
Shame he blotted his copybook.
I see from his Wiki page that he was another former Telgraph columnist.
V8
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 8th, 2024, 7:41 am
by Nimrod103
dealtn wrote:didds wrote:
MPs actually HAVE any dignity and self-respect? Who knew?!
Have you actually met any elected politician? The vast majority (and all of the ones I have met) are engaging and genuine in trying to improve the lives of their representatives.
I guess its easy to default to a cynical position of universal criticism of motives and actions.
I think you mean trying to improve the lives of those they represent? Actually I would have written improve the lives of some of those they represent. Many others will suffer social and financial disadvantage from the actions of elected politicians.
Everybody, and this includes politicians, should be judged fairly on their achievements. What they say and what they come across like, should be treated with a fair dose of scepticism, because politicians are really just salespersons trying to flog their brand of controls and constraints.
Wragg has behaved appalingly, but is being protected by Rishi and Hunt, who he supported in the past. We are being encouraged to treat him leniently because he is being portrayed as a vulnerable gay man, when in reality he is a nasty little schemer and plotter.
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 8th, 2024, 7:40 pm
by Hallucigenia
So this is what persons unknown may have done with the phone numbers given up by Wragg, a BBC journalist who knew Wragg "fairly well" was contacted by someone with an androgynous name pretending to have worked in Parliament and swapped numbers one night :
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-68761113He blocked quickly but supposedly several were sent explicit pictures and at least one reciprocated :
https://www.politico.eu/article/uk-parl ... takeaways/Sounds like Wragg wasn't the only way in :
https://www.politico.eu/article/how-wes ... -phishing/
Re: Wragg Doll
Posted: April 10th, 2024, 7:28 pm
by Hallucigenia
Oh it gets better, not only does he have his password on a bit of paper on his wall, he allows himself to be photographed next to said password by a national newspaper :
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... ne-numbers
[far right, he entered Parliament in 2015]
These are the people that brought us the Online Safety Act 2023 and others....