Donate to Remove ads

Got a credit card? use our Credit Card & Finance Calculators

Thanks to johnstevens77,Bhoddhisatva,scotia,Anonymous,Cornytiv34, for Donating to support the site

FEEDs

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

FEEDs

#14593

Postby youfoolishboy » December 13th, 2016, 7:38 am

A bit of anecdotal for you.
I have been chatting to a few mates and it would appear there is a load of FEED and pre FEED work coming to London. Genesis are rumored to have landed a few and a friend in a FEED specialist company tells me work is picking up there as well, looks like oil companies are starting to test the water.

dspp
Lemon Half
Posts: 5884
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 10:53 am
Has thanked: 5825 times
Been thanked: 2127 times

Re: FEEDs

#14708

Postby dspp » December 13th, 2016, 1:31 pm

yfb - thanks - so do you feel like topping up AMFW on the basis of this ? regards, dspp

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#14773

Postby youfoolishboy » December 13th, 2016, 4:39 pm

The FEEDs and pre FEEDs can easily not turn into design jobs. AMEC/FW are not good a FEED work so not expecting them to get any of that work. So its just a bet on the oil price. If it continues to rise the FEEDs will become design projects if not they go onto the shelf. I am currently working on the design of plant that comes from a 20 year old FEED and it shows! The thing to take from the rise of FEEDs is there is confidence coming to the market which was not present last year but that could easily be shattered from the price of oil falling. Green shoots can easily be trampled.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#14774

Postby youfoolishboy » December 13th, 2016, 4:43 pm

FredBloggs wrote:Really? It still looks like a grave yard from where I'm viewing it, but admittedly I am in Seoul.


Most FEEDs are still done in the West from what I know as the clients want a decent set of P&IDs to start the bidding on so Seoul is probably going to stay quiet till the design bids are required.

Instep
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 159
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 4:52 pm
Has thanked: 176 times
Been thanked: 15 times

Re: FEEDs

#14787

Postby Instep » December 13th, 2016, 5:41 pm

youfoolishboy wrote:Most FEEDs are still done in the West from what I know as the clients want a decent set of P&IDs to start the bidding on so Seoul is probably going to stay quiet till the design bids are required.

epcengineer.com wrote: FEED stands for Front End Engineering Design. The FEED is basic engineering which comes after the Conceptual design or Feasibility study.

https://www.epcengineer.com/definition/ ... ing-design
Useful background. Thanks.
Just had to look it up for the benefit of other lurkers. ;)

Instep

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#14789

Postby youfoolishboy » December 13th, 2016, 5:59 pm

Soz I am so used to the abbreviations.
P&IDs are the Piping & Instrumentation Diagrams basically the plans for any project. They are what the design is based on. They are constantly revised as problems are found and the design is honed. The set produced from a FEED should be mainly right and from these the cost of the job can be reasonably scoped.

Instep
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 159
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 4:52 pm
Has thanked: 176 times
Been thanked: 15 times

Re: FEEDs

#14822

Postby Instep » December 13th, 2016, 7:23 pm

youfoolishboy wrote:Soz I am so used to the abbreviations.
P&IDs are the Piping & Instrumentation Diagrams basically the plans for any project. They are what the design is based on.
It's coming back to me now. I did my first contract job with Foster Wheeler a very long time ago.
Cheers.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#14860

Postby youfoolishboy » December 13th, 2016, 9:34 pm

my first staff role was FW what discipline are you? I am C&I we may have shared an office.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#14911

Postby youfoolishboy » December 14th, 2016, 7:20 am

FredBloggs wrote:
youfoolishboy wrote:
FredBloggs wrote:Really? It still looks like a grave yard from where I'm viewing it, but admittedly I am in Seoul.


Most FEEDs are still done in the West from what I know as the clients want a decent set of P&IDs to start the bidding on so Seoul is probably going to stay quiet till the design bids are required.
Yes, I know. I'm only in Seoul while the UK is dead in the water though.


I am in Italy got lucky this downturn last time it was mainly unemployed with some work in sunny Grangemouth!
My luck is running out though I am rapidly approaching a time when I need to decide if I am going to goto the Middle East on this project and a dry state at that.
Seoul must be good though if you have not got family back home in UK.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#15159

Postby youfoolishboy » December 14th, 2016, 10:32 pm

Fred u got mail

dspp
Lemon Half
Posts: 5884
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 10:53 am
Has thanked: 5825 times
Been thanked: 2127 times

Re: FEEDs

#15229

Postby dspp » December 15th, 2016, 10:03 am

A Dubai based design engineer in O&G confirmed an uptick in front end activity to me FWIW, regards, dspp

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#15900

Postby youfoolishboy » December 17th, 2016, 10:10 am

FW must have put in a low price they have won 2 FEEDs for the Reading office I heard. Certainly all go just now the rising oil price is triggering a lot of activity.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#15960

Postby youfoolishboy » December 17th, 2016, 2:01 pm

No, don't know the names of them only that they are big ones. I am suspecting that they will try and do it with cheap overseas engineers and have a few overworked staffies in the Reading office to continuously reject the work till they get it right that way it can be called a UK project. I suspect they will not be making a massive profit on those jobs as they will have had a lot of competition bidding for them keeping them lean. Personally I cannot get myself to buy AMEC/FW I know them too well from working for them both and as the new company. If this is genuinely the turning point in the cycle then they are a good buy but I feel betting on BP and Shell is more of a safe bet just now than the contractors.

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#16740

Postby youfoolishboy » December 20th, 2016, 8:27 am

Fred
more info on the FEEDs at AMECFW the jobs are for Dhabi Oil Refining Company (TAKREER) and the other with Al Hosn Gas and are being done out of India and UAE as expected, they are not however even going with the pretense of running them out of London it would appear.

mearnsfool
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 185
Joined: November 7th, 2016, 5:29 pm
Has thanked: 7 times
Been thanked: 52 times

Re: FEEDs

#19097

Postby mearnsfool » December 31st, 2016, 7:14 pm

Most of the recent FEED work for UK projects is for quite small projects i.e. a couple of subsea wells tied back to an existing platform.

No real increase in work at all in the small design houses that tend to get the FEEDs.

Rates are also cut back and manhour budgets are quite small.

JPGH
Posts: 5
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 4:44 pm
Has thanked: 5 times

Re: FEEDs

#19292

Postby JPGH » January 1st, 2017, 8:45 pm

Couple of fairly big FEEDs 2027 that I am aware of namely Lake Albert/Buliisa (onshore Uganda, export pipeline FEED also) and also Lokichar (onshore Kenya, including export pipeline).
Some of this work may end up in London, but Paris a likely location for Uganda studies. Deep water projects are mainly tieback type stuff, am aware of an FPSO FEED for SBM in Guyana for Exxon and usual FLNG/LNG (rumours of) FEED study work bin Mozambique/Tanzania.
London based FEED Contractors all plan to be even more quiet (than H2 2016) for H1 2017. Also due to downturn many have left industry permanently so the critical skill "mass" (of expertise needed for execution of numerous large FEEDs all happening in parallel) is also significantly diminished. O&G Companies will go elsewhere (Far East or Houston) or keep work in "favourite" locations e.g. ENI tend to retain work in Milan, Total in Paris.
BREXIT may bring in some scraps of unexpected work to London/South East Contracting companies due to lower manhour rates.

Small to medium Oilies are loaded up to the gills with debt, so struggling with this burden to commit to too much expenditure (FEED studies are sometimes only a small part of the huge expenditure commitments required to deliver the DEFINE phase, which assuing success will eventually leads to Final Investment Decision FID (proposal for board to sanction project). In parallel Partners and numerous other stakeholders will also need to be brought over the line for their respective FIDs/development plan approvals/permitting...etc. All costs money. Subsurface appraisal work expenditure also continues in parallel to FEED studies....hence even though the FEED study component a Contractor sees may not costseem to cost a lot to execute, the Project stage overall expenditure can be very high. Big Oilies can afford to do DEFINE phase greenfield projects including FEED studies in 2017 and all the parallel work, rest of us are really struggling.
JPGH

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#19476

Postby youfoolishboy » January 2nd, 2017, 2:43 pm

JPGH wrote:Couple of fairly big FEEDs 2027 that I am aware of namely Lake Albert/Buliisa (onshore Uganda, export pipeline FEED also) and also Lokichar (onshore Kenya, including export pipeline).
Some of this work may end up in London, but Paris a likely location for Uganda studies. Deep water projects are mainly tieback type stuff, am aware of an FPSO FEED for SBM in Guyana for Exxon and usual FLNG/LNG (rumours of) FEED study work bin Mozambique/Tanzania.
London based FEED Contractors all plan to be even more quiet (than H2 2016) for H1 2017. Also due to downturn many have left industry permanently so the critical skill "mass" (of expertise needed for execution of numerous large FEEDs all happening in parallel) is also significantly diminished. O&G Companies will go elsewhere (Far East or Houston) or keep work in "favourite" locations e.g. ENI tend to retain work in Milan, Total in Paris.
BREXIT may bring in some scraps of unexpected work to London/South East Contracting companies due to lower manhour rates.
JPGH


Not sure I agree that contractors have left the industry never to return. The rates in O&G are normally the best going so people migrate back when there is work, mind you the government is doing its best to discourage anyone working contract at the moment so that will have an impact. I know no one who has changed industry but know a few doing nothing and a few overseas. Regards using Paris and Milan I suspect they may choose UK offices in the future as the reason they keep the EU offices is that it costs too much to fire the staff and then rehire when there is work. If things continue as is i.e. very little work in Europe then they may decide to relocate to UK where workforce is fully flexable. All food for thought but as usual in O&G things only become obvious in hindsight. Currently I see no real work going to the UK but increased FEED work is green shoots where ever its done but I think I may keep out of UK for another year if you hear of any big design contracts hitting London let me know I will get the first flight back!

youfoolishboy
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 233
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:35 am
Has thanked: 22 times
Been thanked: 43 times

Re: FEEDs

#19520

Postby youfoolishboy » January 2nd, 2017, 4:59 pm

FredBloggs wrote: For me, I see no return before Q2 2018 at the earliest and even then only if the project was interesting enough and Mr Hammond not made MyCo Ltd untenable as it soon will be in the public sector.


I am hoping the subsequent shortage of workers in the public sector may cause Mr Hammond to revise his theory.

PeterGray
Lemon Slice
Posts: 847
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:18 am
Has thanked: 781 times
Been thanked: 343 times

Re: FEEDs

#19549

Postby PeterGray » January 2nd, 2017, 6:49 pm

The voracious and hugely out of control public spending machine demands ever increasing proportions of GDP.

Public spending as % GDP has been broadly flat since the peak during WW2. Slightly lower than now till the mid 60s, a bit higher than now for the next 20 years to the mid 80's, then slightly lower until a rise following the 2008 crash, which has now subsided to the long term baseline.

Peter


Return to “Oil & Gas & Energy (Sector & Companies)”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests