Parish Council Minutes - Do I have a right to anonymity?

[ReformedCharacter]

To my regret I've had a dispute with my local Parish Council. I was surprised to find that my name had been given in the PC's minutes which are published on the web. It was quite unnecessary to publish my name to record the issue in the minutes. I'm unsure what my rights are to anonymity, any guidance would be appreciated.

RC

[chas49]

I would think that if your name was given in the discussion which took place in a public meeting (assuming it wasn't a closed meeting for some reason), then it would be hard for you to claim that your name shouldn't be included in the published minutes.

Of course the PC could have decided to redact your name, but if one were in the position of a council resident and taxpayer, one might say "why aren't they publishing these things, what are they covering up?".

[Dod101]

To my regret I've had a dispute with my local Parish Council. I was surprised to find that my name had been given in the PC's minutes which are published on the web. It was quite unnecessary to publish my name to record the issue in the minutes. I'm unsure what my rights are to anonymity, any guidance would be appreciated.

RC

If it was a public meeting (and I have no idea whether PCs are or not but presumably they are) then you can hardly complain about your name being minuted. If it was a good enough point for you to complain, then you should be prepared to stand and be counted. Why ever not?

I might be a bit annoyed as well but if you stand back and think about it.............

Dod

[ReformedCharacter]

To my regret I've had a dispute with my local Parish Council. I was surprised to find that my name had been given in the PC's minutes which are published on the web. It was quite unnecessary to publish my name to record the issue in the minutes. I'm unsure what my rights are to anonymity, any guidance would be appreciated.

RC

If it was a public meeting (and I have no idea whether PCs are or not but presumably they are) then you can hardly complain about your name being minuted. If it was a good enough point for you to complain, then you should be prepared to stand and be counted. Why ever not?

I might be a bit annoyed as well but if you stand back and think about it.............

Dod

I have never attended a PC meeting. All correspondence has been in person and by email.

RC

[Mike4]

To my regret I've had a dispute with my local Parish Council. I was surprised to find that my name had been given in the PC's minutes which are published on the web. It was quite unnecessary to publish my name to record the issue in the minutes. I'm unsure what my rights are to anonymity, any guidance would be appreciated.

RC

If it was a public meeting (and I have no idea whether PCs are or not but presumably they are) then you can hardly complain about your name being minuted. If it was a good enough point for you to complain, then you should be prepared to stand and be counted. Why ever not?

I might be a bit annoyed as well but if you stand back and think about it.............

Dod

A reasonable point that I too was about to make, but then I noticed this is the legal board and the OP was asking specifically about his rights to anonymity, not for opinions about whether expecting anonymity was reasonable in the circumstances.

[Lootman]

To my regret I've had a dispute with my local Parish Council. I was surprised to find that my name had been given in the PC's minutes which are published on the web. It was quite unnecessary to publish my name to record the issue in the minutes. I'm unsure what my rights are to anonymity, any guidance would be appreciated.

If it was a public meeting (and I have no idea whether PCs are or not but presumably they are) then you can hardly complain about your name being minuted. If it was a good enough point for you to complain, then you should be prepared to stand and be counted. Why ever not?

I might be a bit annoyed as well but if you stand back and think about it.............

I have never attended a PC meeting. All correspondence has been in person and by email.

Me neither, but when I sent an email to my council to complain about a proposed development close to my house, my email was published.

So I have never done it again.

[mc2fool]

It being a public meeting -- i.e. one that the public are free to attend -- and them publishing your name on the internet as separate things.

I suspect that the answer is that they have to have told you (buried deep in some fine print at least) beforehand how they'd use your personal data, and in any case I believe you probably have the right to ask them to redact it.

But don't listen to me, 'cos I'm mostly assuming, instead ask the ICO.

https://ico.org.uk/make-a-complaint/ (yes, that looks like the make-a-complaint page but I've always found them more than happy to have an informal chat and give you some idea of where you stand, what questions you should ask (of the PC), etc.)

[ReformedCharacter]

It being a public meeting -- i.e. one that the public are free to attend -- and them publishing your name on the internet as separate things.

I suspect that the answer is that they have to have told you (buried deep in some fine print at least) beforehand how they'd use your personal data, and in any case I believe you probably have the right to ask them to redact it.

But don't listen to me, 'cos I'm mostly assuming, instead ask the ICO.

https://ico.org.uk/make-a-complaint/ (yes, that looks like the make-a-complaint page but I've always found them more than happy to have an informal chat and give you some idea of where you stand, what questions you should ask (of the PC), etc.)

Thanks mc2fool. No, there hasn't been any small print! I've asked the ICO via the link you kindly provided. The person who I spoke to suggested that the PC should have to justify their processing of my data and that I should ask them to do so, under the 'Lawful basis for processing'. The answer is that the PC probably should not have done so, although I would need to make a complaint to ICO for a definitive answer. Thanks for all responses.

RC

[Dod101]

It being a public meeting -- i.e. one that the public are free to attend -- and them publishing your name on the internet as separate things.

I suspect that the answer is that they have to have told you (buried deep in some fine print at least) beforehand how they'd use your personal data, and in any case I believe you probably have the right to ask them to redact it.

But don't listen to me, 'cos I'm mostly assuming, instead ask the ICO.

https://ico.org.uk/make-a-complaint/ (yes, that looks like the make-a-complaint page but I've always found them more than happy to have an informal chat and give you some idea of where you stand, what questions you should ask (of the PC), etc.)

Thanks mc2fool. No, there hasn't been any small print! I've asked the ICO via the link you kindly provided. The person who I spoke to suggested that the PC should have to justify their processing of my data and that I should ask them to do so, under the 'Lawful basis for processing'. The answer is that the PC probably should not have done so, although I would need to make a complaint to ICO for a definitive answer. Thanks for all responses.

RC

It's an interesting question. Would you object if they had simply noted your name in the minutes of the meeting or are you objecting to the minutes being published on the internet and thus broadcasting your name to the world? I think the first is quite correct otherwise they open themselves up to all sorts of cranks and rendering complaints largely meaningless. I think in principle if anyone feels an issue is worth a formal complaint then they should be prepared for their name to be associated with that complaint.

The PC should of course make that clear somewhere.

Dod

[RockRabbit]

Without trying to go OT, I wonder how many people are aware that if they make a planning permission objection, that too is published on the web for all to see? (redaction may be limited to signature, email/phone number - all the content is published). Can get pretty awkward if you complain about your neighbour's planning application and the whole road can read it!

[88V8]

I believe that all Parish Council meetings are public.
So if your name was mentioned it can be published in the minutes, and whether those minutes are then circulated on paper or via the internet is irrelevant.

If anyone objects to a planning issue for instance, their name and correspondence is published on the Council website, so if the PC had a website there is no reason why they should not do the same.

Of course it may not be a planning issue. On the whole our PC chooses not to name names, in the interests of not creating a kerfuffle over the many issues that lurk beneath the placid surface of village life, but that is a choice rather than a right.

V8

[ReformedCharacter]

It being a public meeting -- i.e. one that the public are free to attend -- and them publishing your name on the internet as separate things.

I suspect that the answer is that they have to have told you (buried deep in some fine print at least) beforehand how they'd use your personal data, and in any case I believe you probably have the right to ask them to redact it.

But don't listen to me, 'cos I'm mostly assuming, instead ask the ICO.

https://ico.org.uk/make-a-complaint/ (yes, that looks like the make-a-complaint page but I've always found them more than happy to have an informal chat and give you some idea of where you stand, what questions you should ask (of the PC), etc.)

Thanks mc2fool. No, there hasn't been any small print! I've asked the ICO via the link you kindly provided. The person who I spoke to suggested that the PC should have to justify their processing of my data and that I should ask them to do so, under the 'Lawful basis for processing'. The answer is that the PC probably should not have done so, although I would need to make a complaint to ICO for a definitive answer. Thanks for all responses.

RC

It's an interesting question. Would you object if they had simply noted your name in the minutes of the meeting or are you objecting to the minutes being published on the internet and thus broadcasting your name to the world? I think the first is quite correct otherwise they open themselves up to all sorts of cranks and rendering complaints largely meaningless. I think in principle if anyone feels an issue is worth a formal complaint then they should be prepared for their name to be associated with that complaint.

The PC should of course make that clear somewhere.

Dod

I object to my name being made public whether to local parishioners or the world at large. It was quite unnecessary to do so, I could have been referred to publically as 'a parishioner'. Obviously members of the Parish Council would know my identity so I think your comment about 'they open themselves up to all sorts of cranks and rendering complaints largely meaningless' is a red-herring. I'm sure I have read - but cannot for the moment find - guidance for PCs to keep the identity of complainants confidential. However, I've never made a formal complaint, partly because the PC concerned did not have a proper complaints procedure as set out in guidance to PCs. I don't know how other organisations work but I do know that schools, for example, have 'Part 2s' which discuss things such as complaints where the identity of complainants or those subject to disciplinary actions are kept confidential and those minutes are not made public.

RC

[dionaeamuscipula]

To be sure, I would have to go look at my GDPR stuff and I don't have time, but the PC should probably have a privacy policy (since they are processing your personal data), and there's a good possibility that they do not.

You could ask for a copy of it and see whether they are in breach of their own policy (or don't have one). Or you could just write to them and claim that you have not given informed consent to them publishing your personal data, and requiring it to be redacted or else you reserve your rights, blah blah. They are pretty likely to just do it rather than risk an action they probably know nothing about. All depends a bit, of course, on how aggressive you want to come across to them and probably the whole parish - it may be that gossip about you "threatening" the PC with legal action would actually make things worse and push people to reading the minutes to find out the background, when they otherwise would not.

DM
(whose home address was once put on the internet by a multi billion dollar US business)

[ReformedCharacter]

I believe that all Parish Council meetings are public.
So if your name was mentioned it can be published in the minutes, and whether those minutes are then circulated on paper or via the internet is irrelevant.

V8

Not quite, the principle is that everything should be open and public but there are exemptions:

The exempt information set out at Schedule 12A to the Local Government Act 1972 Act is
as follows:
1. Information relating to any individual.
2. Information which is likely to reveal the identity of an individual.
3. Information relating to the financial or business affairs of any particular person
(including the authority holding that information).
etc.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/335930/140630_Draft_Openness_Guide_-F.pdf

So whether or not that applies in my circumstances, it appears that not everything is 'public'.

RC

[AsleepInYorkshire]

Two things cross my mind here.

1. In "the eyes of a reasonable man" was it necessary to print RC's name? Probably not. The objection or content is the purpose of any meeting. "Outing an individual by name" isn't of any constructive consequence to the meeting. There has to be reasonable thought given to naming individuals by way of protecting them within the community they live in. Potentially "naming" could amount to mental stress. And in that sense the protection from harrassment act 1997 may apply?

2. Is it a lawful requirement that names are made public? Or is there guidance or rules about this? Is there any case law that upholds this behaviour either way?

In your shoes RC I'd want to let them know they have crossed your boundary of anonymity and regardless of acts of parliament or anything else I think I'd invoke the "was this the right thing to do" question. And I don't think it was.

AiY(D)

[Mike88]

It being a public meeting -- i.e. one that the public are free to attend -- and them publishing your name on the internet as separate things.

I suspect that the answer is that they have to have told you (buried deep in some fine print at least) beforehand how they'd use your personal data, and in any case I believe you probably have the right to ask them to redact it.

But don't listen to me, 'cos I'm mostly assuming, instead ask the ICO.

https://ico.org.uk/make-a-complaint/ (yes, that looks like the make-a-complaint page but I've always found them more than happy to have an informal chat and give you some idea of where you stand, what questions you should ask (of the PC), etc.)

I objected to a planning application by my near neighbour. The Council responded to say that they could not take account of my objection unless I agreed to my name and address appearing online. I did agree but it didn't go down to well with my neighbour. I have another objection published online against a planning application appeal by another neighbour. The upshot is that locals are now contacting me objecting to the application wanting me to convey their objections to the Council which I have politely refused to do. Apparently they were afraid to go public for fear of repercussions by the applicant but seemed quite willing for me to take the flak. I doubt whether any Council would respect anonymity and I'm pretty sure there must be something in their conditions to indicate that anonymous comments will not be taken into account.

[Dod101]

I am afraid that I am old fashioned but I would not expect my name to be withheld if I am serious about my complaint. What anyway could you be complaining about? It would not be an earth shattering experience I would have thought. What is the big deal? I really do not have much sympathy with all this nonsense about GDPR. Get a life. If you want to make a formal complain, fine, but why should you be allowed to hide behind some data protection act if you do so?

Dod

[Dod101]

I am afraid that I am old fashioned but I would not expect my name to be withheld if I am serious about my complaint. What anyway could you be complaining about? It would not be an earth shattering experience I would have thought. What is the big deal? I really do not have much sympathy with all this nonsense about GDPR. Get a life. If you want to make a formal complain, fine, but why should you be allowed to hide behind some data protection act if you do so?

Dod

This has not come out quite as I meant. I am not asking what your complaint to the PC is about; what I was trying to say was why would you object to your name being recorded? An anonymous complaint will mean much less than one with a name attached and if you have nothing to hide why not identify the complainant? That means that he/she is serious about it and has nothing to hide.

Dod

[pje16]

About 20 years ago, we had a public meeting in a school gym (well attended as it was to oppose knocking down 8 bungalows in our road and building flats (rare then but far too common now)
Everyone was seated facing the stage and as I was helping with the meeting and someone asked me to go to the back of the room and take a photo to show roughly how may had turbned up
A friendly councillor asked me to get everyone's permisssion for their photo to be taken ( those in the know thought it was a good tip)
I was amazed... it was going to be of the back of their heads
WHAT a precious world we live in

We won by the way

[stockton]

why would you object to your name being recorded? An anonymous complaint will mean much less than one with a name attached and if you have nothing to hide why not identify the complainant? That means that he/she is serious about it and has nothing to hide.

Dod

There are vengeful people about and having your name recorded could result in a massive amount of trouble and expense. The court system unfortunately facilitates ruinous lawsuits.