lockdown 2 - support bubble half in half out

[onthemove]

The new local lockdown rules make a specific exemption for those in a support bubble.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/north-west- ... -cannot-do
"Can I still meet indoors with people in my support bubble?
Yes. Where people from single adult households (people who live alone or single parents with dependent children aged under 18) have formed a support bubble with another household, they can continue to visit each other, stay overnight, and visit other public places as if they were one household."


But what's the situation if one half of the support bubble is in the affected area, the other half isn't?

I mean, obviously the half in the affected area can't go to other people's homes other than within the support bubble, and there doesn't seem to be anything stopping the half in the affected area from travelling outside the affected area to continue the bubble.

But what about the half outside of the affected area?

If that half stays outside the affected area, are they then still free to stay overnight with others, and have other guests in their home, etc (all who are also outside the affected area)?

-

As far as I can tell... the person inside the affected are would be complying with the rules by only visiting within their support bubble (even though it's outside of the affected area).

And, as far as I can tell, the person outside the affected area wouldn't be breaking the rules because (as far as I can tell) the rules only apply to people living inside the affected area.

Have I misinterpreted? Or is this within the rules?

(Visit planned later; as far as I can tell, it looks like it _could_ still be legal; and with annual leave already booked and too late to cancel... well, you get the picture... so just trying to check the specific _legal_ part... we'll consider the non-legal risk assessment separately if applicable - person inside affected area has basically been following full lock down rules throughout - no social visits since pre-lockdown, only shopping for essentials, working from home - even after the rules had started to ease; this visit was going to be the first social contact to a home address, and it looks like it would/could still come under the social bubble exemption - only caveat is the person outside of the area has already been visiting another friend (also living outside the area) after the rules eased nationally)

[onthemove]

Update, after a lot of flip flopping, will we, won't we, decided not to bother with the visit

Bit of a nuisance as all parties had adjusted in preparation - food bought / not bought, etc - and turns out, already being defrosted in anticipation. And for one party it was going to be their first trip out and visiting people, beyond local exercise done on their own, since pre-lockdown.

On balance we suspect it would probably still be legal using the 'support bubble' exemption, but (a separate) part of the reason for the visit (other family visiting) is unambiguously off due to the change in rules, so the remainder we figured perhaps not worth the hassle of worrying whether the neighbours would accept or understand that the visit (we think) would probably be permissible under the support bubble exemption - unfortunately the neighbours all know one party is from the affected area.

Still curious if anyone can shed any clearer light on the original question around how it works with a support bubble that's half in, half out - if the situation doesn't change in a few weeks, we might revisit the idea - but for now, this occasion, decision made ...

..though I have to admit, now made, it really doesn't feel like it was the right decision, but we've just had enough of trying to unscramble the complete and utter anarchic mish-mashed chaos that seems to count for rules around this...

(that was probably the deciding factor, that we'd always be looking over our shoulders wondering if we'd interpreted it right, then whether the neighbours understood it the same way, and if they didn't then whether the police would, if they got called - I've seen that video of the poor police woman telling off that poor bloke for being in his own front garden, both acting in good faith, but the policewoman not correctly informed of the legal position (and who can blame them with the 'law-is-one-thing, guidance-another' approach of Boris) - and apparently the police have already made a visit to another neighbour during lockdown in the surrounding streets after someone tipped them off, so it isn't just a theoretical risk - and in that case the neighbour wasn't misbehaving - the 'informant' had misunderstood that situation).

And it's annoying that it was too short a notice to be able to cancel the annual leave booked.

Maybe will have to go and join the crowds on the beach for a couple of days. That does still seem to be permitted.

[onthemove]

Turns out is was all nonsense.... Matt Hancock lied.

The regulations have only just been published today, and don't come into force tomorrow - the day after we had planned to return anyway.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/202 ... ion/1/made

These Regulations come into force on 5th August 2020.
(...)
the “emergency period”—
(a) starts when these Regulations come into force

Posting rules don't permit me to fully express my seething rage at being so blatantly LIED to by this steaming heap of **** in number 10.

If they expect any further compliance with their rambling edicts then they can take a running ******* jump.

When the very people making the laws LIE to the general public about what is, and what isn't, the law, then democracy and the rule of law is dead.

[terminal7]

When the very people making the laws LIE to the general public about what is, and what isn't, the law, then democracy and the rule of law is dead.

Not so - this is known as the Barnard Castle exemption.

T7

[Watis]

When the very people making the laws LIE to the general public about what is, and what isn't, the law, then democracy and the rule of law is dead.

Not so - this is known as the Barnard Castle exemption.

T7

This is all getting very Mornington Crescent . . .

Watis

[Dod101]

People are getting very hot under the collar. In my part of rural Scotland we pay little attention to what the blessed Nicola says and just apply common sense. We strenuously try to observe social distancing and do not go near beaches or crowded pubs (there aren't any nearby) but see each other in other's houses in small groups and in gardens if the weather is fine. Certainly see family and so far it has all worked out fine. The powers that be cannot possibly prescribe for every event except total lockdown which everyone I think is trying to avoid.

Dod

[UncleEbenezer]

This is all getting very Mornington Crescent . . .

Watis

Insight of the week: Watis finds the underlying inspiration for our government. The spirit of Humph lives on.

[didds]

I'm completely lost as to what contitutes a support bubble now. All i can find on the govt website(s?) is the thing about a single person occupancy can create a bubble with another household (or any size) on a "THIS IS IT FOREVER" basis. But I thought that the "one person household thing" had been surpssed subsequently with a "two households of any kind".

I fully accept I could be wrong about the second bit, and the original "1 + many forever" is still the case...

didds

[UncleEbenezer]

I'm completely lost as to what contitutes a support bubble now. All i can find on the govt website(s?) is the thing about a single person occupancy can create a bubble with another household (or any size) on a "THIS IS IT FOREVER" basis. But I thought that the "one person household thing" had been surpssed subsequently with a "two households of any kind".

I fully accept I could be wrong about the second bit, and the original "1 + many forever" is still the case...

didds

I think you need AND logic there. A support bubble still allows you one companion, but it's no longer the only way to meet up.

After all, being allowed one girlfriend might be good for some of us, but look who's Prime Minister ...

[Mike4]

People are getting very hot under the collar. In my part of rural Scotland we pay little attention to what the blessed Nicola says and just apply common sense. We strenuously try to observe social distancing and do not go near beaches or crowded pubs (there aren't any nearby) but see each other in other's houses in small groups and in gardens if the weather is fine. Certainly see family and so far it has all worked out fine. The powers that be cannot possibly prescribe for every event except total lockdown which everyone I think is trying to avoid.

Dod

The trouble is, the powers that be think they can though, and attempt so to do.

Down here in real life, no-one has a clue what the rules are any longer, and most people default to "using their judgement" or "applying common sense".

Or even worse, both together.

[didds]

A support bubble still allows you one companion, but it's no longer the only way to meet up.

No, I know that...

I'm still unsure what constitutes a "support bubble". that's the question.

[Gersemi]

I'm still unsure what constitutes a "support bubble". that's the question.

"In England, if you live by yourself or are a single parent with dependant children – in other words, if there is only one adult in your home – you can expand your close support network so that it includes one other household of any size. This is called making a ‘support bubble’ and means you are able to have close contact with them as you could if they were members of your own household."

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/meeting-peo ... -household