Can a company force you to turn on your Zoom camera?

[john10001]

Can a company you work for force you to turn on your Zoom camera?

I feel this is very creepy, sinister, and Orwellian not to mention an invasion of privacy.

A camera is not required to communicate and if it hasn't been required all year, since people started working from home at the end of March/beginning of April, but now a company is saying at the beginning of December that it is required, and is harassing you to turn it on, is that legal?

Zoom software has been installed for probably two years and nobody has used it until this year.

So far I would say a third to half have never had a camera switched on, however, some are now starting to drop like flies and fold to the pressure despite being greatly uncomfortable with it.

Finally, if you continue to rebel against this and not switch on the camera are they allowed to hold it against, discipline you, or sack you, if you are otherwise doing a great job?

[johnhemming]

That's an interesting question.

What is the company's reasoning?

Obviously CCTV is often used and can be used to monitor employees. I would not think that by default it would deemed to be unreasonable to ask that cameras are switched on. However, I would not necessarily require this myself. On the other hand it may be that employers wish to ensure that people are actually participating in meetings rather than just being logged on.

[Mike4]

"Can a company you work for force you to turn on your Zoom camera?"

I'd have thought the answer is "no they can't", any more than you can force an employer to continue employing you.

[UncleEbenezer]

I'm sitting at a 'puter with no camera. You might be too, unless perhaps $work has supplied yours?

Or better still, take inspiration from https://dilbert.com/strip/2020-12-03

[mark88man]

I'm sitting at a 'puter with no camera. You might be too, unless perhaps $work has supplied yours?

Or better still, take inspiration from https://dilbert.com/strip/2020-12-03

I've gone off Dilbert in recent years but that was funny!

[AsleepInYorkshire]

Can a company you work for force you to turn on your Zoom camera?

I feel this is very creepy, sinister, and Orwellian not to mention an invasion of privacy.

A camera is not required to communicate and if it hasn't been required all year, since people started working from home at the end of March/beginning of April, but now a company is saying at the beginning of December that it is required, and is harassing you to turn it on, is that legal?

Zoom software has been installed for probably two years and nobody has used it until this year.

So far I would say a third to half have never had a camera switched on, however, some are now starting to drop like flies and fold to the pressure despite being greatly uncomfortable with it.

Finally, if you continue to rebel against this and not switch on the camera are they allowed to hold it against, discipline you, or sack you, if you are otherwise doing a great job?

Your company is required by law to have in place a specific risk assessment to ensure it's employees are not exposed to undue stress.

May I suggest this could be of interest to you please.

Stress At Work - HSE Guidance

I took the liberty of handing my notice in earlier this year when I found myself in a no win position. I could afford to take that decision. I've since found myself feeling a great deal better and I suspect I had been over whelmed by various issues within the business. Poor leadership, impossible deadlines, overwhelming workloads, threatening comments, sexual harrassment by my (female) line manager and generally one of the worst toxic environments I've ever found myself in. The Managing Director fired, the Financial Director resigned, the Group Commercial Director fired, two Senior Quantity Surveyors resigned, the Accounts Manager resigned and generally very low moral all round. And it's commonplace these days.

I'm not sure if you're in a similar place or if it's a specific feeling regarding "surveillance". As such I'm not sure what to suggest. Don't let it get as bad as I did before you do something though.

Take care

AiY

[tjh290633]

You can use a computer without such a camera on Zoom.

TJH

[vrdiver]

Thinking about it, what's the difference between say, sitting in an open plan office where a manager can see everybody at their desks, and having the Zoom camera enabled so the manager can see all the home workers?

Of course, it seems a bit old fashioned to assess people by whether they were at their desk or not; usually these days it's more common to have a deliverables target. The point of working from home, apart from Covid-19 aspects, is that it enables flexibility to self-manage work alongside other tasks, but if your employer is paying you to sit at a desk, then I guess that's the deal...

As an employee, you do have the opportunity to have some fun with Zoom, from spurious background noise, camera offset (so not looking at your face) a smudged camera (a bit of lip balm on the lens goes a long way!) digital backgrounds (some have the side effect of making you disappear if you don't move). All can be very entertaining (or annoying) if deployed from time to time.

You don't say if the employer has given any reason for this "requirement"? Have you asked why? There may be a perfectly logical and sensible argument as to why this is becoming a requirement, or it may be something that can be filed for reference in any future constructive dismissal case, should things come to that. Have you explained your concerns to HR?

Sometimes it's an old-fashioned manager who is dragging their feet, refusing to adjust to the new reality, sometimes it's management trying to do their job as best they can (and not always being as empathetic as you'd like whilst they are doing it). When you've considered all the possible reasons for the increased pressure to use the camera, it would be good to know which, and why.

VRD

[vrdiver]

You can use a computer without such a camera on Zoom.

TJH

Indeed, the computer I'm typing this at doesn't have a camera. I use it for Zoom calls quite happily, only switching to my camera-carrying laptop if I specifically want to use video, rather than just voice and shared screen etc..

I assume the OP's has a camera, quite possibly as a laptop supplied by the employer, hence the question.

VRD

[Lootman]

You can use a computer without such a camera on Zoom.

Indeed, the computer I'm typing this at doesn't have a camera. I use it for Zoom calls quite happily, only switching to my camera-carrying laptop if I specifically want to use video, rather than just voice and shared screen etc..

I assume the OP's has a camera, quite possibly as a laptop supplied by the employer, hence the question.

I find that a piece of tape over my laptop camera works fine. Other folks can still hear me.

[Chrysalis]

Some people don’t have good enough broadband to cope with video calling. Is the company paying for your broadband?
What sort of zoom calls are they? work focussed communications with a few participants who have to be engaged, or unproductive meetings where your presence is simply required to listen? I was recently required to be at the latter, I turned my camera off and got on with making my evening meal, I could still hear everything I needed to.

I am curious about the reason they have given. I think it’s just another manifestation of the anxieties of poor managers who don’t know how to get the best out of people, and confuse management with control.

[mc2fool]

Thinking about it, what's the difference between say, sitting in an open plan office where a manager can see everybody at their desks, and having the Zoom camera enabled so the manager can see all the home workers?

The first is in the employer's premises and the second is in the employee's private home.

The employer has no right to look inside employees' homes ... see what books they have on their bookshelf ... see their pile of dirty socks on the bed if their home "office" happens to be in the bedroom ... see what their spouse and children are doing if the only place the employee has to work is in their living room or kitchen ... etc.

Of course, the first two at least can be dealt with by setting virtual backgrounds -- provided the PC has the horsepower to do so. (Dunno how/if it'd also deal with non-static actual backgrounds, like kids etc moving around).

There's a rather long and seemingly relevant article at https://ukhumanrightsblog.com/2020/09/08/the-right-to-privacy-surveillance-by-software-and-the-home-workplace-philippa-collins/, which on a quick skim I think boils down to saying that current legislation is somewhat lacking and what's needed is for someone to bring a test case to the European Court of Human Rights....

[Aminatidi]

Have to say my first thought wasn't sinister and creepy it was that maybe after nine months they just want people to see one another and a computer screen might still be the only simple way to do this?

If you're concerned ask them and if you're not comfortable whilst I'm not a lawyer I'd expect between various privacy and safeguarding type regs they probably can't force you to do so in your own home.

The flip side is if you choose to put up a fuss about it don't be surprised if they suddenly decide they need certain employees to go into the office more often especially to hold meetings in a covid-secure environment where cameras can be used.

[Mike4]

Have to say my first thought wasn't sinister and creepy it was that maybe after nine months they just want people to see one another and a computer screen might still be the only simple way to do this?

If you're concerned ask them and if you're not comfortable whilst I'm not a lawyer I'd expect between various privacy and safeguarding type regs they probably can't force you to do so in your own home.

The flip side is if you choose to put up a fuss about it don't be surprised if they suddenly decide they need certain employees to go into the office more often especially to hold meetings in a covid-secure environment where cameras can be used.

I have to say my first thoughts were to wonder about the context, which the OP does not mention. I find myself speculating about the reasons for the OP's resistance. It's not as though the employer is asking for the webcam to be ON all the time, only during Zoom sessions, or is it? Is the plan for there to be a Zoom meeting in progress for the whole working day? Is the objection that while in an open plan office, you can see who is looking at you but on Zoom you can't? Is it that he doesn't want the whole company workforce to see into his living room? Is he just objecting on principle? I'd feel rather uneasy about it too although I can't really explain why.

Have to say, when the next round of redundancies comes, those making a fuss now over Zoom might well be first against the wall...

[richfool]

Yes, I didn't quite understand the context of the question. However, the camera in my laptop doesn't work, in that it has a piece of masking tape taped over it.

[johnhemming]

If you're concerned ask them and if you're not comfortable whilst I'm not a lawyer I'd expect between various privacy and safeguarding type regs they probably can't force you to do so in your own home.

I would think that they could make it a requirement of working at home. Hence people potentially have the choice of working at home, but using the camera and getting another job.

[Mike4]

If you're concerned ask them and if you're not comfortable whilst I'm not a lawyer I'd expect between various privacy and safeguarding type regs they probably can't force you to do so in your own home.

I would think that they could make it a requirement of working at home. Hence people potentially have the choice of working at home, but using the camera and getting another job.

Yes this brings in another factor not yet raised.

Is the OP working from home because his employer has made it mandatory, or did he request to WFH and the employer considers it a privilege? Could he just say "No thanks to Zoom, I'll come into the office to work", or is the office closed?

I think this makes a difference, although I'm not sure how.

[gryffron]

Hi,

Legal answer: As mike4 has already said, "Can they force me" is the wrong question.

No, an employer can't force you to do anything. Slavery is illegal.

You work for them because you AGREED to work for them. Presumably because you wanted them to pay you. You signed a contract, remember? So what does the contract say?

In some jobs, TV presenter for example, it would be completely normal and expected. In others, where your meetings with clients are confidential say. it might be entirely inappropriate. I do agree with several other posters that "monitoring bums on seats" is usually a sign of weak managers not trusting their staff. But that doesn't really help you, as using that as an argument will just make them think the worst of you.

Finally, if you continue to rebel against this and not switch on the camera are they allowed to hold it against, discipline you, or sack you, if you are otherwise doing a great job?

Legally, probably. In practice, certainly. IME: Private companies always use redundancies to get rid of non-compliant staff they don't like. The "objective rules" they are supposed to use to make redundancy decisions, are simply tweaked to fit the outcome they wanted in the first place.

Gryff

[johnhemming]

I think this makes a difference, although I'm not sure how.

In the end it is all about the employer-employee relationship. My own view is that people should try to get along and avoid being too procedural. However, at times things get more stressful and then need to move to process (grievance etc). It is in my view better where possible to get another job rather than have continual rows, but it is a complex issue.

[Mike4]

You work for them because you AGREED to work for them. Presumably because you wanted them to pay you. You signed a contract, remember? So what does the contract say?

Good post, but on this specific point of Zooming when WFH, I bet the employment contract turns out to be silent!