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Finances after Death

including wills and probate
RainyDayGeorge
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Finances after Death

#452254

Postby RainyDayGeorge » October 22nd, 2021, 2:15 pm

Ok so I'm getting on a bit and starting to think of practicalities.

I have various investments and shares - nothing that Rockefeller would get excited about but enough that people would like it after I go.

I do have various spreadsheets keeping track of this - and how to access them given that schemes seem to change all the time and it's often tricky to just get on to see my balances etc.

I'm not sharing these details with my spouse - I'm not entirely sure they wouldn't turn their head and think brilliant - I'll have half of that now and waltz off into the sunset...

So what do people do ? Just keep a list of the companies involved somewhere amongst my papers - and the people left behind can do the chasing at the companies ? I'm obviously not going to say - there should be 30k here and 40k there...

If I don't make notes - when would a company notice I've not accessed my share account ? This could be decades later I guess ?

niord
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Re: Finances after Death

#452257

Postby niord » October 22nd, 2021, 2:22 pm

This seems to come up quite regularly. I just put details of my accounts, shareholdings etc (not passwords) on a spreadsheet then print it off and put all the information in my "death file" I update the information on a monthly basis.

scrumpyjack
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Re: Finances after Death

#452258

Postby scrumpyjack » October 22nd, 2021, 2:24 pm

RainyDayGeorge wrote:Ok so I'm getting on a bit and starting to think of practicalities.

I have various investments and shares - nothing that Rockefeller would get excited about but enough that people would like it after I go.

I do have various spreadsheets keeping track of this - and how to access them given that schemes seem to change all the time and it's often tricky to just get on to see my balances etc.

I'm not sharing these details with my spouse - I'm not entirely sure they wouldn't turn their head and think brilliant - I'll have half of that now and waltz off into the sunset...

So what do people do ? Just keep a list of the companies involved somewhere amongst my papers - and the people left behind can do the chasing at the companies ? I'm obviously not going to say - there should be 30k here and 40k there...

If I don't make notes - when would a company notice I've not accessed my share account ? This could be decades later I guess ?


I keep a file of notes for my executor in my deed box and have told my daughter where it is.

pje16
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Re: Finances after Death

#452259

Postby pje16 » October 22nd, 2021, 2:29 pm

I have recorded all the organisations and contact details of every financial account/organisation I have on a password protected spreadsheet and given a copy to my brother (he and I are solid)

We have both done this as clearing out an deceased relative's house a few years with no records whatsover to go on was a nightmare
just had to wait for monthly statements etc to drop on the doormat (he was old school)
These days records/statements arte mainly web based, so how does anyone know what you've got if you hit by that surprisingly dangerous bus :roll:

Lootman
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Re: Finances after Death

#452260

Postby Lootman » October 22nd, 2021, 2:31 pm

For me, nothing as formal as a spreadsheet. Just a hand-written note with the name of the bank/broker, the account number and password if it is an online account (two are not). Holdings and valuations change too much to bother annotating them.

I keep this in the safe but my next of kin know the safe combination.

My beneficiaries are also my executors, and have power of attorney access as well. Your next of kin may need to act on your behalf both before and after your death, and the combination of being an attorney and an executor means that they can seamlessly act on your behalf. In fact using the POA will get them used to what I have, where it is and how to access it anyway, sort of like a practice run!

I have given some thought to converting the accounts to joint accounts, where that is possible and at the right moment, to further facilitate access to my accounts.

RainyDayGeorge
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Re: Finances after Death

#452262

Postby RainyDayGeorge » October 22nd, 2021, 2:34 pm

Excellent stuff - sounds very similar to what I plan to do.
I was just wondering if I'd missed a trick and there was a simple solution.

There must be millions of pounds locked up in dormant accounts in the country I'd guess ?

AsleepInYorkshire
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Re: Finances after Death

#452302

Postby AsleepInYorkshire » October 22nd, 2021, 4:18 pm

RainyDayGeorge wrote:Ok so I'm getting on a bit and starting to think of practicalities.

I have various investments and shares - nothing that Rockefeller would get excited about but enough that people would like it after I go.

I do have various spreadsheets keeping track of this - and how to access them given that schemes seem to change all the time and it's often tricky to just get on to see my balances etc.

I'm not sharing these details with my spouse - I'm not entirely sure they wouldn't turn their head and think brilliant - I'll have half of that now and waltz off into the sunset...

So what do people do ? Just keep a list of the companies involved somewhere amongst my papers - and the people left behind can do the chasing at the companies ? I'm obviously not going to say - there should be 30k here and 40k there...

If I don't make notes - when would a company notice I've not accessed my share account ? This could be decades later I guess ?

Can I, because this is so important and pertinent to me, just slightly stray off-topic please. Please make sure you have a lasting power of attorney with someone you trust. Not a general power of attorney, but a lasting power of attorney. If I may, when your time comes to redirect your soul to the next world, you will have no real say over your ultimate exit strategy. That's something for your body and possibly clinicians to decide upon.

I don't have a lasting power of attorney for my Mum. She is suffering with terminal cancer and in the last two weeks has had a stroke. Without the lasting power of attorney I'm unable to have as much "influence" over her medical affairs. I would have preferred that additional security.

If you leave a will and a list of what's where in your will or attached to it then your executors will be very grateful. They will be able to contact various bodies and close out business by producing a copy of your death certificate.

Take care

AiY

pje16
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Re: Finances after Death

#452304

Postby pje16 » October 22nd, 2021, 4:20 pm

Hey AIY
sorry to hear that your mum has deteriorated
can you not apply for POA now?
https://www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney
and
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/famil ... meone-else

AsleepInYorkshire
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Re: Finances after Death

#452317

Postby AsleepInYorkshire » October 22nd, 2021, 4:54 pm

pje16 wrote:Hey AIY
sorry to hear that your mum has deteriorated
can you not apply for POA now?
https://www.gov.uk/power-of-attorney
and
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/famil ... meone-else

A lasting power of attorney takes about 2 months to put in place. Unfortunately Mum's prognosis 4 weeks ago was 3-12 weeks. As she moves into the care home there are obligations for them as she now falls under the mental incapacity act. Mum's wish when she was told 3-12 weeks was to go home. However, no carers were available so I made my own arrangements. Since then she's deteriorated and as she needs 2 people to move her to the toilet, and Continuing Care can't even provide 1 I've had to reluctantly accept she goes into a care home. So for all the Care Act of 2014 says "wherever possible" the patients wishes should come first it has boiled down to something more sinister than that. It's comes down to a lack of forward planning, horizon complacency and an acceptance that no one can do anything about it. I have engaged with the Care Commission Group locally and perhaps when that process reaches a conclusion I'll update the community on a more appropriate board.

Sorry this is off-topic but I wanted to reply out of pure courtesy and I've rambled :roll:

AiY

pje16
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Re: Finances after Death

#452319

Postby pje16 » October 22nd, 2021, 4:59 pm

No AIY
it's close to being on topic
Sorry bud I didn't realise your mum was so bad
you have my sympathy through this diffcult time
all the best
Paul

dionaeamuscipula
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Re: Finances after Death

#452842

Postby dionaeamuscipula » October 25th, 2021, 9:48 am

RainyDayGeorge wrote:
If I don't make notes - when would a company notice I've not accessed my share account ? This could be decades later I guess ?


The answer on this point is: effectively never. The shareholder (and their representatives) is responsible for updating details on company registers.

DM

stewamax
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Re: Finances after Death

#452912

Postby stewamax » October 25th, 2021, 1:00 pm

AsleepInYorkshire wrote:Since then she's deteriorated and as she needs 2 people to move her to the toilet, and Continuing Care can't even provide 1 I've had to reluctantly accept she goes into a care home.


Apologies for being practical. Two points:
- if she has someone with her for at least part of the day, having a catheter makes a huge difference. The bag needs emptying twice a day - tap open, gush, tap shut, easy. If she is bedridden, there are much larger 'night bags' that only need emptying once a day. The Community Nurse service will insert the catheter but it then stays in place for 12 weeks or longer. They are painless, and for particularly for ladies (they have much a shorter 'plumbing'), a non-event. There are also one-shot catheters that are used for those not bedridden but have 'lost the need to go' (as can happen with e.g. MS)
Faeces can be removed with a neoprene glove and KY jelly, particularly if the patient is constipated and using a commode or toilet yields nothing.

- a hoist does, as you will have found out, need two people to operate it. Nurses have instruction never to do it single handed unless in extremis.

I am not a medic, just someone who has been through the mill for someone close to me.

ten0rman
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Re: Finances after Death

#452929

Postby ten0rman » October 25th, 2021, 1:54 pm

I'm somewhat late to the party. Apologies for that - there are reasons, which are not germain to the OP's question.

The OP's question, along with post death taxation & IHT is something I have been giving a lot of thought to recently, especially as due to age differences, and my poor health, it is very likely that I will die before my wife. In a similar manner to the OP, I have managed to accumulate a reasonable amount of money which I have split between my, and my wife's ISA accounts. My wife does not know how much we have: this is because if she did know, firstly I suspect there may well be a Viv Nicholson type of spending spree, and secondly, I do have a suspicion that she might have been got at by one or more religious cults.

My will states that our three children are my executors, gives a modest amount of money to each of the children, and leaves the rest to my wife. My wife's will, unless she has indeed been got at - and I have no intention of asking her about since it might trigger off something - is a mirror image of my own. Our ISA's are held via a platform which does not send out paper accounts, therefore my executors would need to watch my/our incoming emails for at least six months in order to discover what is going on. For my purposes, I do have two spreadsheets which do contain information from which the relevant information may be gleaned plus downloaded statements which are kept in a folder on the computer.

In addition to the above, there are the pensions to consider. As the lucky holder of a defined benefit pension, my wife will be entitled to half of my pension, except that it is more complex than that: as my pension is subject to GMP/COD, this also means that my wife's State Retirement Pension will be increased following my death. Which in turns means that both the pension provider and DWP will need advising of my death.

And then, there will be the awkward consideration of income tax following my death.

So, what else have I done. In general, I am aware of a lot of the taxation, particularly IHT, problems that can occur. I have therefore decided to keep my affairs as simple as possible, eg ensure that the total value of bequests is less than the IHT allowance, and ensure that other than gifts from excess income, there will be no other gifts to take into consideration provided I live until at least August 2022. I cannot do anything about income tax, but I have ensured that between us, we only have a relatively small amount of cash readily available and held in joint accounts, with everything else, both cash & investments, being held in ISA's.

Because of all the above, I have produced a set of files, kept on the computer under an easily identifiable name, which gives as much information as I deem necessary. I have them as computer files as I can then easily update them as necessary. All three of our children have been advised by email of their existence, the title of the main folder, and whereabouts they will be found on the computer. The children have been advised to keep the email handy for future reference, and with three children, I think there is a reasonable chance that at least one of them will remember about the files.

Finally, I have a number of copies of this information spread over two computers and two external hard disks, thus there is a good chance that the children should be able to find the files when the time comes.

Regards,

ten0rman


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