Raise the prices / wages

[Howyoudoin]

Just got back from my local The Italian Job pub. They’re struggling to find bar staff.

Went to my local fish restaurant last night. They’re struggling to find both front and back of staff.

When we will admit that we haven’t been paying people a fair wage for a long time now? Hiring immigrants on minimum wage might solve things in the short term but in the long term it causes massive problems, hence Brexit.

In my opinion, food and drink prices need to increase by about 10% across the board, at pubs/restaurants and especially supermarkets (the latter to help out British farmers).

I doubt there are many people that enjoy dining and drinking out that would be upset with a 10% price rise but if there are, I guess there will be many more businesses going to the wall.

It’s time to put your hand in your pocket and help out your local pubs and restaurants.

HYD

[AleisterCrowley]

A sizeable chunk of the price of a pint goes to the government. From memory our beer duty is one of the highest in Europe
The pub can't add much of a margin to a high starting price - so they can't really afford to pay staff much and still make a living, particularly in London with high rent/business rates

[Howyoudoin]

A sizeable chunk of the price of a pint goes to the government. From memory our beer duty is one of the highest in Europe
The pub can't add much of a margin to a high starting price - so they can't really afford to pay staff much and still make a living, particularly in London with high rent/business rates

Whilst most of what you have said is true, it’s clearly false that they can’t afford to pay staff more IF they raise their prices, which is my point.

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

HYD

[Midsmartin]

they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

Not necessarily if it's £2 in Tesco, or less in Aldi.

[SteMiS]

When we will admit that we haven’t been paying people a fair wage for a long time now? Hiring immigrants on minimum wage might solve things in the short term but in the long term it causes massive problems, hence Brexit.

In my opinion, food and drink prices need to increase by about 10% across the board, at pubs/restaurants and especially supermarkets (the latter to help out British farmers).

Brexit, the gift that just keeps giving...

[AF62]

In my opinion, food and drink prices need to increase by about 10% across the board, at pubs/restaurants and especially supermarkets (the latter to help out British farmers).

Absolutely not.

Pubs have been doing this for years (although to be fair often driven by being tied to a brewery and their beer prices rigged); customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices to make up, so customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices…

Wetherspoons (love them or hate them) worked this out years ago - cut the prices and you sell more beer (and food) and can employee staff to bring the beer to you that you ordered from your table without needing to try and get the barman’s attention in a 20 deep crowd.

People have a disposable amount of income. Increase prices by 10% and they spend 10% less when they go out. Doesn’t help anyone.

[Howyoudoin]

they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

Not necessarily if it's £2 in Tesco, or less in Aldi.

Hey hotshot, I was talking about eating and drinking out, not in.

HYD

[AleisterCrowley]

A sizeable chunk of the price of a pint goes to the government. From memory our beer duty is one of the highest in Europe
The pub can't add much of a margin to a high starting price - so they can't really afford to pay staff much and still make a living, particularly in London with high rent/business rates

Whilst most of what you have said is true, it’s clearly false that they can’t afford to pay staff more IF they raise their prices, which is my point.

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

HYD

Price elasticity - people will carry on smoking approx the same if you increase prices, but if you increase beer prices the 'in pub' demand will drop.
In the case of pubs people will probably spend more in supermarkets

[Howyoudoin]

In my opinion, food and drink prices need to increase by about 10% across the board, at pubs/restaurants and especially supermarkets (the latter to help out British farmers).

Absolutely not.

Pubs have been doing this for years (although to be fair often driven by being tied to a brewery and their beer prices rigged); customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices to make up, so customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices…

Wetherspoons (love them or hate them) worked this out years ago - cut the prices and you sell more beer (and food) and can employee staff to bring the beer to you that you ordered from your table without needing to try and get the barman’s attention in a 20 deep crowd.

People have a disposable amount of income. Increase prices by 10% and they spend 10% less when they go out. Doesn’t help anyone.

Well, the 10% price increases are coming, whether you like it or not.

Many immigrants have gone home since the start of the pandemic and haven’t come back (yet). Hence pubs and restaurants can’t find anyone to work for minimum wage as the British won’t work for that, in the main.

Something has to give soon and I think it will be an uplift in prices.

HYD

[AleisterCrowley]

Might be a local (to London) thing
The pubs back home (W Mids) don't seem to have any problems retaining staff - there's a lot of demand for part-time work
Even here in West Berkshire they don't seem to have any staff problems. I'm assuming that pub wages compared to cost of living are better outside London - particularly accommodation costs.

[Howyoudoin]

A sizeable chunk of the price of a pint goes to the government. From memory our beer duty is one of the highest in Europe
The pub can't add much of a margin to a high starting price - so they can't really afford to pay staff much and still make a living, particularly in London with high rent/business rates

Whilst most of what you have said is true, it’s clearly false that they can’t afford to pay staff more IF they raise their prices, which is my point.

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

HYD

Price elasticity - people will carry on smoking approx the same if you increase prices, but if you increase beer prices the 'in pub' demand will drop.
In the case of pubs people will probably spend more in supermarkets

Not sure the stats bear that out Aleister.

I smoked for 30 years and then stopped due to my Wife but I don’t think I could ever stop drinking alcohol despite her best endeavours and I think she’s accepted that now.

Question to you: Would you rather have three pints in a pub at a cost of £16 or three cans at home at a cost of £5?

If your answer is the latter, we will lose pubs for sure.

HYD

[AF62]

In my opinion, food and drink prices need to increase by about 10% across the board, at pubs/restaurants and especially supermarkets (the latter to help out British farmers).

Absolutely not.

Pubs have been doing this for years (although to be fair often driven by being tied to a brewery and their beer prices rigged); customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices to make up, so customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices…

Wetherspoons (love them or hate them) worked this out years ago - cut the prices and you sell more beer (and food) and can employee staff to bring the beer to you that you ordered from your table without needing to try and get the barman’s attention in a 20 deep crowd.

People have a disposable amount of income. Increase prices by 10% and they spend 10% less when they go out. Doesn’t help anyone.

Well, the 10% price increases are coming, whether you like it or not.

Many immigrants have gone home since the start of the pandemic and haven’t come back (yet). Hence pubs and restaurants can’t find anyone to work for minimum wage as the British won’t work for that, in the main.

Something has to give soon and I think it will be an uplift in prices.

HYD

I suggest this is a very regional issue, with London being different.

Around here the vast majority of minimum wage pub and restaurant workers are British, even the front of house staff in the couple of nearby Chinese takeaways I use are British.

[AleisterCrowley]

Whilst most of what you have said is true, it’s clearly false that they can’t afford to pay staff more IF they raise their prices, which is my point.

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

HYD

Price elasticity - people will carry on smoking approx the same if you increase prices, but if you increase beer prices the 'in pub' demand will drop.
In the case of pubs people will probably spend more in supermarkets

Not sure the stats bear that out Aleister.

I smoked for 30 years and then stopped due to my Wife but I don’t think I could ever stop drinking alcohol despite her best endeavours and I think she’s accepted that now.

Question to you: Would you rather have three pints in a pub at a cost of £16 or three cans at home at a cost of £5?

If your answer is the latter, we will lose pubs for sure.

HYD

I don't go to the pub to just drink - it's the social aspect. If I was just interested in getting sloshed I wouldn't go anywhere near a pub. I had two pints in a Reading pub last Friday and that was £10 so close to your (unlikely!) £5.3333333.../pint

[Howyoudoin]

Absolutely not.

Pubs have been doing this for years (although to be fair often driven by being tied to a brewery and their beer prices rigged); customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices to make up, so customers / beer sales fall, so increase prices…

Wetherspoons (love them or hate them) worked this out years ago - cut the prices and you sell more beer (and food) and can employee staff to bring the beer to you that you ordered from your table without needing to try and get the barman’s attention in a 20 deep crowd.

People have a disposable amount of income. Increase prices by 10% and they spend 10% less when they go out. Doesn’t help anyone.

Well, the 10% price increases are coming, whether you like it or not.

Many immigrants have gone home since the start of the pandemic and haven’t come back (yet). Hence pubs and restaurants can’t find anyone to work for minimum wage as the British won’t work for that, in the main.

Something has to give soon and I think it will be an uplift in prices.

HYD

I suggest this is a very regional issue, with London being different.

Around here the vast majority of minimum wage pub and restaurant workers are British, even the front of house staff in the couple of nearby Chinese takeaways I use are British.

Yes I’m talking about London, where there are hardly any British pub and restaurant staff.

HYD

[Howyoudoin]

Price elasticity - people will carry on smoking approx the same if you increase prices, but if you increase beer prices the 'in pub' demand will drop.
In the case of pubs people will probably spend more in supermarkets

Not sure the stats bear that out Aleister.

I smoked for 30 years and then stopped due to my Wife but I don’t think I could ever stop drinking alcohol despite her best endeavours and I think she’s accepted that now.

Question to you: Would you rather have three pints in a pub at a cost of £16 or three cans at home at a cost of £5?

If your answer is the latter, we will lose pubs for sure.

HYD

I don't go to the pub to just drink - it's the social aspect. If I was just interested in getting sloshed I wouldn't go anywhere near a pub. I had two pints in a Reading pub last Friday and that was £10 so close to your (unlikely!) £5.3333333.../pint

We seem to be in agreement about the reasons for going to the pub.

If you think £5.33 a pint is unlikely, you’re not drinking in Central London.

HYD

[Mike4]

A sizeable chunk of the price of a pint goes to the government. From memory our beer duty is one of the highest in Europe
The pub can't add much of a margin to a high starting price - so they can't really afford to pay staff much and still make a living, particularly in London with high rent/business rates

Whilst most of what you have said is true, it’s clearly false that they can’t afford to pay staff more IF they raise their prices, which is my point.

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

HYD

A pint of top quality bitter hit £5 here in rural Wiltshire a couple of years ago.

But as I never tire of saying in threads about this, when you buy beer in a pub you are not paying for just the beer, but short-term renting a space in the building that probably has £1m of capital invested to allow it to open its doors to the public. £5.50 an hour to rent a square metre of space in a pub in which to socialise strikes me as a bloody good deal, never mind the trade price of the beer they are giving you.

[AF62]

Well, the 10% price increases are coming, whether you like it or not.

Many immigrants have gone home since the start of the pandemic and haven’t come back (yet). Hence pubs and restaurants can’t find anyone to work for minimum wage as the British won’t work for that, in the main.

Something has to give soon and I think it will be an uplift in prices.

HYD

I suggest this is a very regional issue, with London being different.

Around here the vast majority of minimum wage pub and restaurant workers are British, even the front of house staff in the couple of nearby Chinese takeaways I use are British.

Yes I’m talking about London, where there are hardly any British pub and restaurant staff.

HYD

I wouldn’t limit that statement to pub and restaurant staff in London, but the whole of the minimum wage employment area; or at least that seemed to be my impression whilst I was commuting into London.

As for pub and restaurant prices going up to solve it? Perhaps, but probably not. If there is a shortage of workers people will move to the ‘best value’ jobs which are not necessarily the best paid. Aldi and Lidl pay significantly more than Tesco and Sainsbury’s, but lots prefer to work for Tesco and Sainsbury’s because the work is easier.

What is the easiest minimum wage job? Pub / restaurant, supermarket, coffee shop? Whichever it is will have sufficient staff and the others won’t.

[AleisterCrowley]

Not sure the stats bear that out Aleister.

I smoked for 30 years and then stopped due to my Wife but I don’t think I could ever stop drinking alcohol despite her best endeavours and I think she’s accepted that now.

Question to you: Would you rather have three pints in a pub at a cost of £16 or three cans at home at a cost of £5?

If your answer is the latter, we will lose pubs for sure.

HYD

I don't go to the pub to just drink - it's the social aspect. If I was just interested in getting sloshed I wouldn't go anywhere near a pub. I had two pints in a Reading pub last Friday and that was £10 so close to your (unlikely!) £5.3333333.../pint

We seem to be in agreement about the reasons for going to the pub.

If you think £5.33 a pint is unlikely, you’re not drinking in Central London.

HYD

It was the recurring decimal places after the .33 i found unlikely

[jfgw]

If people are willing to pay £14 for 20 Benson and Hedges, they will surely pay £5.50 for a pint of lager.

I for one wouldn't pay anything, let alone £14, for cigarettes. This has no bearing whatsoever on what I would pay for lager or (in my case) real ale.

Tobacco is highly addictive - someone once offered me £5 for one cigarette (not that I had one). If the price of beer goes up, I will drink less of it.


Julian F. G. W.

[88V8]

I don't think London is England any more.

Out here in the sticks there seems no problem retaining/recruiting staff.

Do agree though that supermarket food is too cheap, farm prices have not kept pace with inflation. I would happily pay more if it went to the farmer.

I don't go to pubs to drink. Other than yoof, is it a thing any more? Surely the smoking ban killed the drinking trade.
Our local did 400 covers/week pre-covid, that's what kept them afloat.
If I want to drink, we have bottled craft beers in the cellar, and they didn't come from the pub. Unless Aldi raise their prices, pubs won't be able to.

V8