DAK if these TV Licensing bullies have any actual authority?

[vrdiver]

sending me warnings that on <whatever> date a few weeks in the future I would be getting a visit from enforcement officers. I've had perhaps six appointments issued now but no-one ever turns up, disappointingly.

I wonder what would have happened if you'd confirmed their appointment, stating that you would be taking the day off work in order to accommodate them? If they hadn't turned up, would you have been entitled to compensation?

VRD

[ReformedCharacter]

Watching the video, it's curious how the second bod ignores the doorbell button and bangs on the glass of the front door instead. We know there is a dorrbell button as it is a Ring video doorbell taking the video!

I guess they are trained to do this but I'm not sure why.

Yes, probably. I got really hacked off recently with a delivery bod who insisted on banging on the door and ringing the bell. He told me that they were told to do that. Some just bang on the frosted glass within the front door which I also find annoying - I suppose I'm getting to be an old grump - and sometimes I point out the doorbell. But I do live in Cornwall and the village has only had mains electricity since the 50's and perhaps some are still getting used to it.

RC

[Maroochydore]

My wife likes to watch TV so we have a licence.

However every year when it's renewal time we take out a new licence, one year in my name, next year in her name, third year in my name, ad nauseum.

We get the letters, they send the one about further investigation and presumably conclude that the property is licenced, which is how it should be, the property not the person. At least it makes them do a bit of work.

A good stock answer to their question is "I don't have a gun licence either". No one comes to check whether I actually own a gun so why is a TV any different?

[servodude]

Watching the video, it's curious how the second bod ignores the doorbell button and bangs on the glass of the front door instead. We know there is a dorrbell button as it is a Ring video doorbell taking the video!

I guess they are trained to do this but I'm not sure why.

Yes, probably. I got really hacked off recently with a delivery bod who insisted on banging on the door and ringing the bell. He told me that they were told to do that. Some just bang on the frosted glass within the front door which I also find annoying - I suppose I'm getting to be an old grump - and sometimes I point out the doorbell. But I do live in Cornwall and the village has only had mains electricity since the 50's and perhaps some are still getting used to it.

RC

Yeah it's a thing.
...and it kind of makes sense in this age of battery powered lightweight wireless doorbells (remember trying out the old fancy ones in B&Q next to the car radios?!), or indeed the expensive ones that rely on your wifi working, especially where folk are on commission for whatever reason they're chapping your door.

[XFool]

A good stock answer to their question is "I don't have a gun licence either". No one comes to check whether I actually own a gun so why is a TV any different?

Does a gun licence require annual renewal?

[didds]

I wonder what would have happened if you'd confirmed their appointment, stating that you would be taking the day off work in order to accommodate them? If they hadn't turned up, would you have been entitled to compensation?

VRD

"dream on" is i believe the unfortunate answer.

[jfgw]

Remind me: what are Pink Marshmallows here?

It is a racist term meaning "white person's buttocks".

On a more serious note regarding doorbells, they often don't work. Ring ones usually work but there is a delay between the button being pressed and the internal chime or mobile phone alerting the occupier. If I am calling around someone's, I try the bell first and wait a while before knocking. A delivery driver or TV licence goon would waste a lot of time doing this. I can fully understand why a delivery driver would be instructed to both knock and ring.


Julian F. G. W.

[JohnB]

People often bang on the wood of the door rather than use the big metal knocker. I just asume they are dim and on autopilot

[AleisterCrowley]

You'd think they'd spot big knockers

[Maroochydore]

A good stock answer to their question is "I don't have a gun licence either". No one comes to check whether I actually own a gun so why is a TV any different?

Does a gun licence require annual renewal?

No, every five years for a legal firearm. Never for an illegal firearm.

[scotia]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

About 65 years ago I saw a TV detector Van - theoretically in action. It was evening, and a Fish & Chip Van was making its rounds in our street. As we patiently queued for our chips, a Van (with large lettering declaring that it was a TV Detector Van) drew up, and its occupant joined the queue. He loudly proclaimed that they had a technical hitch, so their apparatus wasn't working - but they would get it repaired and would be back the next day. Presumably a number of licences were hurriedly purchased the following day. I didn't see the detector Van again.

[servodude]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

About 65 years ago I saw a TV detector Van - theoretically in action. It was evening, and a Fish & Chip Van was making its rounds in our street. As we patiently queued for our chips, a Van (with large lettering declaring that it was a TV Detector Van) drew up, and its occupant joined the queue. He loudly proclaimed that they had a technical hitch, so their apparatus wasn't working - but they would get it repaired and would be back the next day. Presumably a number of licences were hurriedly purchased the following day. I didn't see the detector Van again.

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

[XFool]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

Long, long ago I 'heard'/'understood' that it was either from a signal generated by the line-flyback circuitry in CRT TVs or RF from the tuner's local oscillator. Don't know how true any of that ever was.

[scotia]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

Long, long ago I 'heard'/'understood' that it was either from a signal generated by the line-flyback circuitry in CRT TVs or RF from the tuner's local oscillator. Don't know how true any of that ever was.

Some years ago I worked with a team of consultants with a range of Engineering backgrounds. One of them was a security specialist, and he told us of a test which he had performed at the boundary fence of a major defence establishment. With his specialist equipment he claimed that he could pick up the text being displayed on CRTs inside the base.

[servodude]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

Long, long ago I 'heard'/'understood' that it was either from a signal generated by the line-flyback circuitry in CRT TVs or RF from the tuner's local oscillator. Don't know how true any of that ever was.

IIRC both; fly back (at 625 * 25 hz) indicated a demodulated CRT signal and then you could pickup up the colour subcarrier oscillator also. The lecturer told us we needed to know the precise frequency for the exam as its specified tolerance is 1ppm - he was taking the piss and 4.43MHz would have sufficed (obviously it's different of you live in a region with "Never The Same Colour-twice" )

If you've ever tried to play an electric guitar (with single coils anyway) in front of a computer monitor you'll appreciate just how much noise they put out

[servodude]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

Long, long ago I 'heard'/'understood' that it was either from a signal generated by the line-flyback circuitry in CRT TVs or RF from the tuner's local oscillator. Don't know how true any of that ever was.

Some years ago I worked with a team of consultants with a range of Engineering backgrounds. One of them was a security specialist, and he told us of a test which he had performed at the boundary fence of a major defence establishment. With his specialist equipment he claimed that he could pick up the text being displayed on CRTs inside the base.

I don't doubt it.
My favourite of this kind of thing though is Theremin's "Thing"
- a giant big wooden seal that the Americans were given and stuck on a wall... but worked like a mic if you knew where to look (or transmit a carrier signal)

[AleisterCrowley]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

Long, long ago I 'heard'/'understood' that it was either from a signal generated by the line-flyback circuitry in CRT TVs or RF from the tuner's local oscillator. Don't know how true any of that ever was.

Some years ago I worked with a team of consultants with a range of Engineering backgrounds. One of them was a security specialist, and he told us of a test which he had performed at the boundary fence of a major defence establishment. With his specialist equipment he claimed that he could pick up the text being displayed on CRTs inside the base.

Yes, I've seen a demo of that. It's all covered by TEMPEST
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tempest_(codename)
There was a lot of info in Spycatcher re using electromagnetic emanations to read encrypted data ( I think by picking up the faint emissions of the unencrypted signal)
On the plus side, the RF spectrum is so noisy these days it's practically impossible to detect a faint signal!

[Rhyd6]

An inspector did call on a friend of ours about 4 years ago, they live near Bala in a small village which overlooks the lake. I think he and his mate just fancied a day in the country myself. They knocked at the door and asked if they had a TV, they answered in the affirmative and asked the 2 chaps to come and view their unique TV. Fair play they both chuckled when they were confronted with a very old 1960's TV in a beatiful mahogany cabinet. The tube had been removed and a square fish tank fitted. As my friends said, more interesting than anything produced by the BBC.

R6

[csearle]

As for TV Detector Vans - not sure they ever really worked - and they almost certainly wouldn't now ...

About 65 years ago I saw a TV detector Van - theoretically in action. It was evening, and a Fish & Chip Van was making its rounds in our street. As we patiently queued for our chips, a Van (with large lettering declaring that it was a TV Detector Van) drew up, and its occupant joined the queue. He loudly proclaimed that they had a technical hitch, so their apparatus wasn't working - but they would get it repaired and would be back the next day. Presumably a number of licences were hurriedly purchased the following day. I didn't see the detector Van again.

We covered the principles of how they "could" work in comms as undergrads; with the caveat that the actually "worked" as a threat.
Certainly there's nothing emitting from a post CRT TV in any amplitude that you could use to identify a TV from a distance.

I suppose a low-tech way, when there were only three channels, could have been to correlate the flickering from the curtains with the flickering of each channel's picture.

Along the same lines, and also being a bit facetious here, one thing that emits from a post CRT TV is light, so if they manage to peek in through a window they could "detect" it. Maybe the detector in a TV detector van is the driver!

[XFool]

There was a lot of info in Spycatcher re using electromagnetic emanations to read encrypted data ( I think by picking up the faint emissions of the unencrypted signal)
On the plus side, the RF spectrum is so noisy these days it's practically impossible to detect a faint signal!

Tell me about it!