Side hustle ideas

[Bigspenda]

I'm not quite ready to FIRE yet, but assuming I do manage it I would like to have the option to be able earn some extra money if investment returns are reduced for a while.
Aside from getting a job in a supermarket/bar/shop etc I was wondering if anyone has any other ideas. Ideally it would be something that can be done from home, preferably internet based and with no commitment to specific hours. Also not requiring any skill that couldn't be learned fairly quickly.
On this board I have seen matched betting mentioned which seems like the sort of thing I was thinking of. Is there anything else? Has anyone tried things like teaching English via skype or proof reading which are two I've seen mentioned elsewhere?

[dealtn]

I don't think you can put the phrases "match betting" and "earn some extra money" in the same sentence!

[Itsallaguess]

I'm not quite ready to FIRE yet, but assuming I do manage it I would like to have the option to be able earn some extra money if investment returns are reduced for a while.

Ideally it would be something that can be done from home, preferably internet based and with no commitment to specific hours.

I'm like you, in that I'm still working and not yet quite ready with the whole FIRE aspect just yet, but I do give it an increasing amount of thought, and often specifically around the potential for some sort of 'top-up funding', if I might ever find the need for that, and I've got to say that absolutely none of those thoughts ever revolve around what options I might have that could be home / internet / variable-hours based...

I say this only because I often tend to think that at least *some* level of regular, 'out-of-the-house', paid activity would most probably do me the world of good, so long as I can find something that I would enjoy doing, at the same time as allowing it to provide at least *some* sort of regular drum-beat through any given week (which I think I am likely to need, or at least partially, after a lifetime of regular 5-day working...), as well of course as delivering the potential 'nice-to-have' cash too...

Of course there's also voluntary work as well, which I also regard as a very worthwhile endeavour, and is something I would also like to look into should the FIRE day actually ever happen, but I just wanted to comment that perhaps looking for something that at least 'looks and feels' a bit more like 'work' might be more rewarding than the home-based stuff that you might currently be thinking about?

I also think such low-level 'work' might also offer the best 'effort / reward' ratio too, as I think lots of home-based schemes that you might currently be considering can often suck in so much of your potential FIRE time, that any 'actual return' might seem a crazy trade-off in the real world of some of those schemes...I mean, what's not to like about simply getting your shoes and jacket on, putting an odd couple of hours in somewhere that you like, and coming home and forgetting about it until next time....

And that's before we get onto the 'match-betting' side of things, which I've just got to say seems to me to be the absolutely last thing I'd be looking to do if my primary aim was to help provide some simple, regular, top-up funding, but perhaps you'll find yourself better at it than I can ever dream I would be....

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

[swill453]

Match betting or matched betting?

Scott.

[Itsallaguess]

Match betting or matched betting?

Good point, and well-spotted, but - would it make much difference, ultimately?

Even 'matched-betting' still wouldn't ever be my 'go-to' resource for FIRE top-up funding...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

[Bigspenda]

Sorry, match betting, as mentioned in the Manchester FIRE meeting notes.
In my dream world I'd FIRE and never 'need' to work. I'd like to do travelling and voluntary work, hence ideas for things that could earn money without any specific commitment.
The reason for discussing this is that the current crash and loss of dividend payouts is making me rethink my strategy which had been based on a HYP-ish portfolio and live mainly off dividends assuming a SWR of 4%. If (more like when) another event like the current crash occurs it would nice to be able earn some cash to help make up for reduced dividends.
So my choice seems to be assume a lower SWR (3%?) and work for another few years, or retire as per plan on the assumption that I will somehow earn some money if/when there is a reduction in dividends.
I had always assumed I would get a job in shop or similar if I needed money desperately, but if there's other ways it would be interesting to know.

[redsturgeon]

Sorry, match betting, as mentioned in the Manchester FIRE meeting notes.
In my dream world I'd FIRE and never 'need' to work. I'd like to do travelling and voluntary work, hence ideas for things that could earn money without any specific commitment.
The reason for discussing this is that the current crash and loss of dividend payouts is making me rethink my strategy which had been based on a HYP-ish portfolio and live mainly off dividends assuming a SWR of 4%. If (more like when) another event like the current crash occurs it would nice to be able earn some cash to help make up for reduced dividends.
So my choice seems to be assume a lower SWR (3%?) and work for another few years, or retire as per plan on the assumption that I will somehow earn some money if/when there is a reduction in dividends.
I had always assumed I would get a job in shop or similar if I needed money desperately, but if there's other ways it would be interesting to know.

What about AirBnB for a spare room in your house? Some people I know have build studios in their gardens and let them out. Dead at the moment of course but a nice little money earner otherwise.

John

[swill453]

Sorry, match betting, as mentioned in the Manchester FIRE meeting notes.

Hmm, both "match betting" and "matched betting" were mentioned on that thread (and not expanded on) so the picture is a bit confusing.

Personally I suspect they weren't talking about betting on football matches.

Scott.

[SalvorHardin]

Sorry, match betting, as mentioned in the Manchester FIRE meeting notes.

Match betting, aka Matched betting, is never going to be a reliable earner. That's because it involves taking advantage of bookmakers' special offers and these won't last forever. You open accounts with multiple bookmakers and get free bets. You then bet on all possible eventualities (using several bookmakers and the betting exchanges) and you will make money.

The problem is that the bookmakers are wise to this. Sooner or later (probably sooner) people find their accounts being closed and it becomes all but impossible for them to open an account with any bookmaker. It's also quite hard work as this article points out:

https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/a3mg ... could-make

One person ("Shaun") mentioned in the above article who is making serious money isn't doing match betting. Instead he's arbitraging the difference in bookmakers' odds. You make a bet in one place and either lay off the bet on the exchanges or make other bets elsewhere so that you've covered all eventualities and come out with a small profit on the event. That is a way to make money.

The problem is arbitrage is hard work, you've got to be reasonably good at arithmetic to avoid making mistakes under time pressure and it's quite easy to drift into becoming a bookmaker yourself by using the betting exchanges to accept bets which you haven't laid off. Also the bookies are pretty good at spotting arbitrageurs, which leads to accounts being shut.

[Bigspenda]

Thanks for the link Salvorhardin. That confirms what little I knew about matched betting in that's its probably not something you could do for long.
The airbnb option might be more realistic. My FIRE plans require me to downsize, so it would be worthwhile considering somewhere with airbnb potential.

[kempiejon]

I've matched bet, this was some years (10?) ago when there was big bonuses coming out the bookies, hundreds of pounds per bookmaker and fiarly simple waging requirements, similarly casinos were offering large cash incentives to attract customers, in a couple of years I took a few grand. Arbitrage as Salvorhardin has pointed out is an ongoing wheeze but it's hard work and one mistake can wipe out day of profits and you need a pretty large float to play with, I was doing matched betting and arbitrage with my bookie bonuses but once the bonuses became smaller and requirements to complete more difficult I decided it wasn't for me any more.

Rent a room, hire your parking space, doing surveys, there are loads of money making options out there have a hunt about. Just a passing comment this really isn't about investing but working or alternative income streams as such is this the best board or even website to hunt for tips?

[Bigspenda]

Fair point about whether this is the correct board. I only mentioned it because 'side hustles' are a part of the overall FIRE philosophy and match betting was bought up in another post on this boardt. As I understand it, FIRE is a combination of a specific investing strategy, LBYM-style living and potential 'side hustles' to make extra money on your own terms. Does it justify another board, or can it be accommodated by this board and LBYM?

[kempiejon]

Fair point about whether this is the correct board. I only mentioned it because 'side hustles' are a part of the overall FIRE philosophy and match betting was bought up in another post on this boardt. As I understand it, FIRE is a combination of a specific investing strategy, LBYM-style living and potential 'side hustles' to make extra money on your own terms. Does it justify another board, or can it be accommodated by this board and LBYM?

Bigspenda as this is the place where like minded FIRE people hang out it's a good start but in terms of part time income, money savings etc "retirement investing" filters out some of the wider ideas available, as I suggested, there might be better websites to hunt.
Back on topic my side hustles have been matched betting and casino bonuses but to my mind that's dried up. If you've ime there's surveys for pennies and Quidco for all shopping, There's a few quid in stoozing and cash back recycling, 2 properties ago I rented a room to a student when I worked at the local university.

[Hariseldon58]

Well I have been FIRE since 2007 at 49, markets of course promptly crashed then too... it happens, so this is my 2nd major crash post FIRE (several pre FIRE as well of course)

The side hustles I found were more for structure and the money was a bonus, problem with relying on a side hustle to bolster income when markets turn nasty, is that the real economy often wobbles at the same time..

Surveys were often fun but you would struggle to earn minimum wage. You can monetise a hobby, eg photography but again I found that enjoyable but not a real earner but does subsidise a hobby... I became a “Handyman” part time for a few years, but the danger is that can quickly become very much like a job, demand can exceed the part time hours ( not too many) you wanted to work...

Volunteering, you are valued at the price you charge for your service.... zero, still satisfying despite that !

On the other hand market dips provide some opportunities, 2007-2009 was heavy falls but substantial rises in some investment trusts that had fallen to heavy discounts and I have had some success in the last few weeks, switch from ETFs at par value and go into an investment trust that has suffered a significant increase in the discount ( for no obvious reason other than market sentiment) let the situation correct and go back to your original passive ETF for a turn.

Law Debenture was one example recently, not a certainty of course, it’s a form of arbitrage and LWDB was good for a quick 10k over a few days, better than a part time job ! I hasten to add that I only do this with trusts I am happy to hold if necessary and have familiarity with.

[tikunetih]

I'm not quite ready to FIRE yet, but assuming I do manage it I would like to have the option to be able earn some extra money if investment returns are reduced for a while.

I've posted previously of my opinion that perhaps much of the so-called FIRE blogging scene is a bit of a crock, often operated by people who appear not to have retired but simply embarked upon a lifestyle/career change. Absolutely nothing wrong with pursuing different careers during your lifetime, but that's probably not such a sell-able meme, hence no doubt the appeal to promoters of a pretence at retirement with so-called "side hustles", with the latter actually being the unacknowledged new career.

Call me old fashioned, but my view of "financial independence" is that it means you have no need to go to work or to secure other income because you already posses sufficient means. Being financially independent enables retirement, if you so choose. But, if someone has need of additional income then clearly they're not financially independent.


Often (though not always) people who do manage to retire early do so because they've enjoyed higher than average earnings during their working life, or perhaps enjoyed some business success or other means or acquiring sufficient capital to consider leaving behind employment or whatever it was they used to do. On departing the workplace/business/whatever it's quite likely that they'll progressively lose the skills that allowed them to enjoy those higher earnings or acquire the capital that made possible their retirement. Within a few years of becoming deskilled in their former craft, they may well find that it impossible to return to it, meaning that any employment they take may, unless they've acquired valuable new skills in the meantime, be (much) less lucrative than their pre-retirement role.

I don't know what age you are, but since you're implying an early retirement of some sort then if you enjoy average mortality then you're likely to be retired and living off investments for two, three, four or more decades. A long time!

That being the case, and if past is prelude, then you will experience multiple bear markets over your remaining investment horizon. No ifs, just whens, and on multiple occasions, plus if you're unlucky then perhaps worse bear markets than those seen in recent decades.


Further to my "becoming progressively deskilled" point above, I'd recommend ensuring you try to make the most now of any higher earnings potential you currently posses, to reduce to an acceptable level the risk that you may one day be forced back into an unwelcoming workplace against your will...

Consider your future self, perhaps 20 years older than you are today, maybe suffering ill health to some degree, facing the prospect of needing to find additional income. Imagine this occurring during a deep and prolonged equities bear market where selling your risk assets at low prices for a sustained period would permanently damage your portfolio. You could be faced with trying to secure some sort of low income, low skilled job at a time of high unemployment when no employer is remotely interested in you such that it may be impossible to find something even if you wished to. I'm intentionally painting a negative picture because that is the downside case that bad luck may realistically bring you one day.

So I think you should plan with all that in mind: size and structure your portfolio accordingly; set your withdrawal rate conservatively; have flexibility within your budget to trim it if required for sufficient periods of time to prevent permanent damage to your capital.

NB I'm not suggesting working for ever because sufficient is never enough, but rather just to be sensibly prudent about the capital/income required to support your plan so that the likelihood of very bad outcomes is reduced to an acceptable level for you. By necessity this will be a bit "finger in the air", informed by history, but no guarantees.

I see this is terms of regret minimization: making decisions now so that your future self thanks you for having made reasonable (not perfect) choices balancing the risk of working yourself into the grave by never letting up vs. the risk of going much to early, running out of capital and ending up in a dark place.

[Lootman]

An old friend said to me, upon turning fifty, that "at our age we don't need jobs; we need capers". That has stuck with me, not least because I retired around that age.

So the only money I have made since then were from running a pub quiz (income was trivial, mostly taken in beer), trading coins and selling off some things here and there.

The best hustles, other than investment-based which we all do anyway, are things that have a finite start and end, and short duration, so more like a deal or "caper". For instance you buy a home knowing you can flip it for a profit. Or you issue a bridging loan to someone moving house, with appropriate collateral of course. Or invest in a business where someone else does all the work, like my kids.

But works per se is irksome to me these days.

[JohnB]

A good thing is if your ex-employees approach you for 'one more job' at contractor rates, as mine did in Jan. A better thing us having enough money to say no after 30 seconds thought!

You could do psychology experiments, they pay and are mildly interesting, but you need to match their demographics. Or you could try out new drugs...

[TahiPanasDua]

I left my profession as an architect at the age of 56 and my "retirement" goal at the time was almost non-existent. In practise, I resolved to do only what interested me and even not too much of that. Financial compensation was rarely a consideration.

After a couple of years of enjoyable faffing about, I took a one month highly intensive course in teaching English as a foreign language. This allowed me to continue to work overseas in various countries and join my wife as a teacher at the British Council in 7 countries. I only worked very part time but loved it. Eventually, I did a bit of tutoring which I also loved.

The original poster suggested editing as a possibility. I have done that for 20 years and love it. I started by editing literature translations for the Slovak government. Editing is rarely simply correcting grammar as overseas work sometimes requires total rewrites which is fun. The work flow is very sporadic which suits me but as you are usually the last person in line prior to publication you are frequently given minimal time to complete the job, the only downside. For decades, I have been editing 2 or 3 times a year for a friend who runs a substantial business in Hong Kong. I have been doing this gratis but in recent years she has repaid me handsomely by letting us use one of her vacant flats in Hong Kong whenever we like.

I hadn't intended to write my life story but almost have. Sorry.

TP2.

[TahiPanasDua]

Sorry, I should have said proofreading instead of editing. I call it editing as that is much closer to what I do.

TP2.

[gryffron]

Being a subject for proper market research (not online) can be quite interesting as a sideline. Though not exactly a career.

They often have small high street offices where you can go and sign up. Expect a lot of Qs about your lifestyle before you get any work. I got into it through a friend who worked there. But their surveys often want wealthy professionals or retirees, who rarely approach them.

Most I ever got paid was £50 for 2 hours telling the RSPB what I thought of their plans to buy up the forests of Java (not much). But I can also proudly state I have been a PROFESSIONAL beer drinker.

Gryff