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SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

Discuss Stock buying Shares, tips and ideas for stock market dealing
kiloran
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397154

Postby kiloran » March 19th, 2021, 3:39 pm

dspp wrote:
kiloran wrote:
TUK020 wrote:How would this interact with the HYPTUSS tool?
Would it offer the possibility of speeding up the data access?

I don't think there is any possibility of this. It would require the storing of data for all HYP (and non-HYP :o ) shares. That's a lot! And it would also be another potential failure point in the process.

--kiloran


kiloran,

Imagine for a moment that TLF took a market close shareprice snapshot each day and put that in a database. Imagine that all dividends and splits and etc were also stored and coded into that database. That would give HYPTUSS a reliable single source of information to call from would it not ? That might make things easier rather than harder.

I'm not necessarily advocating this, indeed you will have seen my comments that tend towards the "where are you going" type. Nevertheless one can see the potential.

regards, dspp

Yes, I can see some potential benefits, dspp. But the downsides are significant:
  1. Where would the data come from? RELIABLE data. From some analysis I've recently done, data quality can vary significantly from site to site. Reported dividends on ADVFN, Sharecast, Morningstar and others are often different. With HYPTUSS as currently configured, we can at least provide users with a choice.
  2. If the process breaks, who fixes it? Itsallaguess and I can handle HYPTUSS issues, but what about problems with data on the server? Would that be up to Stooz to fix? Or the data provider? Or would Stooz allow IAAG and I access to the processes on the LF server (with the risk that we might muck up TLF!). And would IAAG and I want to get involved in server issues?
  3. What about adding new shares to the process? At the moment, each HYPTUSS user has total control on which shares are reported. The suggested alternative would require Stooz or whoever to add shares to the database.
  4. I'm not clear what copyright issues might be involved. I'm sure we can't just grab data from any arbitrary source and republish it on TLF. This dicussion started with some interest in Finnhub data, but from what I have read, their data is for personal use only (even paying up to $1000 per month for it)
In the last 10 years or so of my working life, that's exactly the kind of thing I was involved in..... grabbing data from various sources, writing them to a SQL database and providing tools (web pages, spreadsheets, emails) to report the data from the database. For a well-controlled business environment, it worked fine, but I think for a varied group of external users such as Lemon Fools, it can cause more problems than it might solve.

Sorry if I sound overly negative, I'm trying to give an honest appraisal of the issues. And I'm certainly open to being persuaded otherwise.

There are many many providers of this kind of information, and Lemon Fool cannot compete with them. I think we should focus on our core strengths, the provision of a forum where the community can discuss financial and other issues.

--kiloran

dspp
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397157

Postby dspp » March 19th, 2021, 3:47 pm

kiloran wrote:
dspp wrote:
kiloran wrote:I don't think there is any possibility of this. It would require the storing of data for all HYP (and non-HYP :o ) shares. That's a lot! And it would also be another potential failure point in the process.

--kiloran


kiloran,

Imagine for a moment that TLF took a market close shareprice snapshot each day and put that in a database. Imagine that all dividends and splits and etc were also stored and coded into that database. That would give HYPTUSS a reliable single source of information to call from would it not ? That might make things easier rather than harder.

I'm not necessarily advocating this, indeed you will have seen my comments that tend towards the "where are you going" type. Nevertheless one can see the potential.

regards, dspp

Yes, I can see some potential benefits, dspp. But the downsides are significant:
  1. Where would the data come from? RELIABLE data. From some analysis I've recently done, data quality can vary significantly from site to site. Reported dividends on ADVFN, Sharecast, Morningstar and others are often different. With HYPTUSS as currently configured, we can at least provide users with a choice.
  2. If the process breaks, who fixes it? Itsallaguess and I can handle HYPTUSS issues, but what about problems with data on the server? Would that be up to Stooz to fix? Or the data provider? Or would Stooz allow IAAG and I access to the processes on the LF server (with the risk that we might muck up TLF!). And would IAAG and I want to get involved in server issues?
  3. What about adding new shares to the process? At the moment, each HYPTUSS user has total control on which shares are reported. The suggested alternative would require Stooz or whoever to add shares to the database.
  4. I'm not clear what copyright issues might be involved. I'm sure we can't just grab data from any arbitrary source and republish it on TLF. This dicussion started with some interest in Finnhub data, but from what I have read, their data is for personal use only (even paying up to $1000 per month for it)
In the last 10 years or so of my working life, that's exactly the kind of thing I was involved in..... grabbing data from various sources, writing them to a SQL database and providing tools (web pages, spreadsheets, emails) to report the data from the database. For a well-controlled business environment, it worked fine, but I think for a varied group of external users such as Lemon Fools, it can cause more problems than it might solve.

Sorry if I sound overly negative, I'm trying to give an honest appraisal of the issues. And I'm certainly open to being persuaded otherwise.

There are many many providers of this kind of information, and Lemon Fool cannot compete with them. I think we should focus on our core strengths, the provision of a forum where the community can discuss financial and other issues.

--kiloran


I hear you about the problems. I've been there !

Nonetheless I was checking that aspect of it was not being discarded without due consideration.

I also tend to agree with you that it is not the best place for TLF to put its efforts.

regards, dspp

Lanark
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397159

Postby Lanark » March 19th, 2021, 3:51 pm

I'm also thinking this is probably a bad idea, I don't really see how it would integrate into the forum in a useful way.

If the numbers are updated quickly and reliable and made open to all, then a bunch of scrapers are likely to start hitting the site to grab that juicy data, thats going to affect bandwidth/running costs. Perhaps if you put it behind some kind of paywall for donating members and limited the number of views per day?

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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397173

Postby vrdiver » March 19th, 2021, 4:31 pm

My first thought was that this would be an initial step towards integration with HYPTUSS, but I see that's been dismissed. A shame, but I understand if it would just add complexity without value. If that integration was the underlying thought behind the idea, then I'd be interested.

However, adding today's share price to say, the top of each post on the Company Shares" board, or some such, would, in my view, add confusion. Imagine a poster referring to the current price, but not actually quoting the number (because it's displayed already). Coming back a week later and the price could be drastically different, leaving the post totally out of context or otherwise misleading / confusing.

If the share prices are accessible via a separate tab, then I already have that, either via my copy of HYPTUSS, or for more details, my broker account or other web sites / stock exchange sites, so I doubt I would use the TLF data or even bother to set it up (if I had to select shares to display data).

VRD

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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397176

Postby mc2fool » March 19th, 2021, 4:46 pm

Don't do it Stooz! IMHO it'll be opening a can of worms. No matter how many "as is" statements you make it'll be a case of ...

Prices not up to date: complain to Stooz
Data looks wrong: complain to Stooz
Missing the XYZ ticker: complain to Stooz
Any other problems: complain to Stooz
Extra features wanted: pester Stooz
:
:
:

Wuffle
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397276

Postby Wuffle » March 20th, 2021, 7:30 am

If TLF is about anything it's long wavelength stuff.
That is it's USP.
What it currently is will not be enhanced by instantaneous tickers.
If you want it to go somewhere else, that is different. And already occupied for the most part.

W.

Cornytiv34
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397339

Postby Cornytiv34 » March 20th, 2021, 10:30 am

I see no personal reason to" reinvent the wheel". Instant prices are not one of my requirements. I can appreciate others might want this information but if it is just a wish to have all the information in one place I fail to see how the normal TLF financial news is a neccesary requirement for instant trading.
Mike

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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397811

Postby AndyPandy » March 22nd, 2021, 12:44 am

Gengulphus wrote:
AndyPandy wrote:If Admin is itching to expand the site, why not move the Forum off the root of the Domain so that there can be a Home page with options such as "Forum" (obv.) and "Useful websites", "Beginners guide to investing", "Zen and the art of HYP maintenance" and so on. Could even include some Affiliate links etc to monetise the website. Guest Bloggers?

I think one just needs to look at the history of TMF to see a reason why not to do that: aiming to "monetise" the website is liable to lead to the boards being marginalised and eventually dropped...

Gengulphus


I had TMF in mind when I wrote it and would hope that TLF learnt the lessons from there. TLF is a lot leaner with no paid staff to fund. Perhaps for 'monetise' read 'cover the cost of the Hosting'. Perhaps it does already with donations & monetisation is not needed. Either way, I still think some extra low-maintenance sections would be better use of Admins' time than Live data that the majority (that have opined here) don't want.

GoSeigen
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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397818

Postby GoSeigen » March 22nd, 2021, 6:19 am

I've visited Bloomberg's home page practically every day for the past ten years or more. I can't say I've ever once referred to the silly ticker thing at the top of the page for a live price. [In fact I've made deliberate attempts to remove it at times!!] Same with IG Index, been with them almost 20 years, never even glanced at the prices they display on their login page.

I have a list of the share prices I want to see in appropriate places (usually provided by brokers) and am comfortable with their reliability. I doubt I'd ever use a TLF facility unless it were top-notch with features I wanted -- and that is not going to happen.

GS

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Re: SHARE PRICES ON TLF ?? Do you want them?

#397874

Postby tjh290633 » March 22nd, 2021, 10:03 am

GoSeigen wrote:I've visited Bloomberg's home page practically every day for the past ten years or more. I can't say I've ever once referred to the silly ticker thing at the top of the page for a live price. [In fact I've made deliberate attempts to remove it at times!!] Same with IG Index, been with them almost 20 years, never even glanced at the prices they display on their login page.

I have a list of the share prices I want to see in appropriate places (usually provided by brokers) and am comfortable with their reliability. I doubt I'd ever use a TLF facility unless it were top-notch with features I wanted -- and that is not going to happen.

GS

I have a watchlist on Bloomberg, which I can order on any parameter, should I so wish, change on the day, value, alphabetical, and the only problem is their limit of 20 shares per watchlist. I also have their app on my phone, which gives me the same information.

Note that they limit the number of articles which you can read without a paid subscription, but they do daily newsletters which are worth scanning for information about US affairs, and also notofications of articles as they are published.

TJH


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