Musings around flights to West Australia.

[BullDog]

Well, I would like to visit West Australia probably Q1 2023 and have been looking at the most cost effective way of getting there in reasonable comfort, business class travel, basically. London to Perth direct is ruled out on cost, £4500 return for business class.

I see UK to WA return flights are around £3500 typically a route of UK to European hub to Singapore to Perth. Given that the UK levies punitive tax on long haul business class flights originating in the UK, I had an idea of getting a price for a flight originating from the European hub airport. To my surprise, omitting the UK flight returned pretty much the same prices. One flight each way less on the ticket. So are airlines profiteering? Or something else going on?

I have found that a UK to European hub to Singapore business class return ticket can be had for around £1800 to £1900. An astonishing saving versus the typically £3500 fare if I included Perth.

There's plenty of flights from Singapore to Perth. So I think a night at a Changi Airport hotel and a bearable next day economy class flight Singapore to Perth probably saves me in excess of £1000 compared to flying through on one ticket. Two people travelling, so a very useful saving.

What do TLFers think? Thanks.

[Dod101]

I go to Perth WA from time to time but would take Premium Economy to Singapore and then get a cheapie flight to Perth. Business Class is a waste of money unless someone else is paying. I too will probably try subject to Covid to go in early 2023 but usually do not think about it until about the end of November. That is quite soon enough.

Dod

[richfool]

For Info, Scoot Air, a budget/subsidiary of Singapore Air, fly from Singapore to Perth, if that helps with the onward leg.

[servodude]

For Info, Scoot Air, a budget/subsidiary of Singapore Air, fly from Singapore to Perth, if that helps with the onward leg.

Just a warning that it's a rebranded TigerAir; probably because they were THAT bad they needed to rebrand.
Honestly can't think of another carrier I remember being completely suspended because of safety issues.
They might have improved, but I'd really put them at the bottom of my list (in stark contrast to Singapore Air)

[Dod101]

For Info, Scoot Air, a budget/subsidiary of Singapore Air, fly from Singapore to Perth, if that helps with the onward leg.

Don't I know it.....and they are horrible. So much so that sitting in Perth I rebooked on Singapore Airlines for the return trip back to Singapore. The Ryan Air of SEA. In light of servotude's post that is probably being unkind to Ryan Air.

Dod

[BullDog]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

[servodude]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Look for a budget/economy flight that's a codeshare with a proper airline if you can:

https://www.airportia.com/flights/qf72/singapore/perth/
- could be bought through Jetstar

[Dod101]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

As you say its your money. I can have three weeks around SEA including 5/6 days in WA for around £3,000 all in including hotels. And I used to travel First, London/Hong Kong for years. (Someone else was paying)

Dod

[Dod101]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Look for a budget/economy flight that's a codeshare with a proper airline if you can:

https://www.airportia.com/flights/qf72/singapore/perth/
- could be bought through Jetstar

QF used to be very good and the safest airline in the skies but my recent experiences with them (mostly domestic Australia) have not been very brilliant. They were OK.

Dod

[BullDog]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Look for a budget/economy flight that's a codeshare with a proper airline if you can:

https://www.airportia.com/flights/qf72/singapore/perth/
- could be bought through Jetstar

Thanks. It's not perfect, but Kayak is pretty good at identifying those opportunities.

[BullDog]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Look for a budget/economy flight that's a codeshare with a proper airline if you can:

https://www.airportia.com/flights/qf72/singapore/perth/
- could be bought through Jetstar

QF used to be very good and the safest airline in the skies but my recent experiences with them (mostly domestic Australia) have not been very brilliant. They were OK.

Dod

I believe with A380's being removed from fleets, long haul air travel has taken a very big backward step generally, to be frank. Nothing is the same as A380 business class for 12 hour plus flights.

[servodude]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Look for a budget/economy flight that's a codeshare with a proper airline if you can:

https://www.airportia.com/flights/qf72/singapore/perth/
- could be bought through Jetstar

QF used to be very good and the safest airline in the skies but my recent experiences with them (mostly domestic Australia) have not been very brilliant. They were OK.

Dod

Much less competition than they need these days (I was surprised that flight linked had 11 code shares)

-sd

[richfool]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Yep, I can entirely sympathise with that. I lived in Thailand for many years and used to fly long haul, between London and Bangkok, firstly with Thai Air, economy, then EVA Air, Premium Economy, and then as I get sleeping problems and back problems, I ended up upgrading to Business Class, and after that found I couldn't go back (to Premium Economy). So if long haul, I fly Business class now.

Sometimes I flew on to Adelaide, where I have a son living, in which case I flew Malaysian, Business class, via KL, which was fine too. I have done that from both LHR and from Bangkok. I did once fly Phuket - Singapore - LHR with Singapore Airlines in 2008 on one of their first A380's, though that was Economy.

Now if long haul, I have to fly Business class. Agreed re the Singapore to Perth part of the OP's journey, I wouldn't have an issue with Economy. LHR - SIN is 14 hours! LHR - KUL - 13 hours.

Points noted re Scoot. I have read many poor reviews. Though I know of someone who is poised to fly with them from Vientiane, Laos via Singapore to Perth!

[BullDog]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Yep, I can entirely sympathise with that. I lived in Thailand for many years and used to fly long haul, between London and Bangkok, firstly with Thai Air, economy, then EVA Air, Premium Economy, and then as I get sleeping problems and back problems, I ended up upgrading to Business Class, and after that found I couldn't go back (to Premium Economy). So if long haul, I fly Business class now.

Sometimes I flew on to Adelaide, where I have a son living, in which case I flew Malaysian, Business class, via KL, which was fine too. I have done that from both LHR and from Bangkok. I did once fly Phuket - Singapore - LHR with Singapore Airlines in 2008 on one of their first A380's, though that was Economy.

Now if long haul, I have to fly Business class. Agreed re the Singapore to Perth part of the OP's journey, I wouldn't have an issue with Economy. LHR - SIN is 14 hours! LHR - KUL - 13 hours.

Points noted re Scoot. I have read many poor reviews. Though I know of someone who is poised to fly with them from Vientiane, Laos via Singapore to Perth!

Thanks, I quite agree. I now have very painful joints and I can't cope with being packed like a sardine for more than about 5 hours. It's a sad fact that if I want to go long haul now, I either pay up for business class or I don't go. It looks well worthwhile breaking the journey in Singapore and travelling to Perth*** the next day. I could cope with that in economy. Previously, I have travelled straight through, but I was working and earning good money then. For two people travelling the money saved would pay for a few hotels and car hire.

*** Also mulling over a trip to Northern Queensland, via either Singapore or probably Jakarta as that is closer to Cairns.

It's awful getting old, but it's better than the alternative.

[stevensfo]

Thanks very much for the thoughts. Regarding business class flights, I never fly more than 5 or 6 hours without it being business class. Being comfortable is far more important to me and it's my money. For 12 hour plus flights a lie flat business class seat in my opinion is earth every penny if I get a night's sleep. And I usually do, typically 6 or 7 hours sleep.

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return. Star Alliance group operators look very competitive on this route. In the past I have booked well priced Lufthansa tickets and the flight was a Singapore Airlines code share flight, much more expensive if booked with Singapore rather than Lufthansa. Then -

Stay overnight in Changi and take economy to Perth the next day. I think that's looking like a sweet spot of comfort and cost.

Happy to hear any more thoughts.

Yep, I can entirely sympathise with that. I lived in Thailand for many years and used to fly long haul, between London and Bangkok, firstly with Thai Air, economy, then EVA Air, Premium Economy, and then as I get sleeping problems and back problems, I ended up upgrading to Business Class, and after that found I couldn't go back (to Premium Economy). So if long haul, I fly Business class now.

Sometimes I flew on to Adelaide, where I have a son living, in which case I flew Malaysian, Business class, via KL, which was fine too. I have done that from both LHR and from Bangkok. I did once fly Phuket - Singapore - LHR with Singapore Airlines in 2008 on one of their first A380's, though that was Economy.

Now if long haul, I have to fly Business class. Agreed re the Singapore to Perth part of the OP's journey, I wouldn't have an issue with Economy. LHR - SIN is 14 hours! LHR - KUL - 13 hours.

Points noted re Scoot. I have read many poor reviews. Though I know of someone who is poised to fly with them from Vientiane, Laos via Singapore to Perth!

Thanks, I quite agree. I now have very painful joints and I can't cope with being packed like a sardine for more than about 5 hours. It's a sad fact that if I want to go long haul now, I either pay up for business class or I don't go. It looks well worthwhile breaking the journey in Singapore and travelling to Perth*** the next day. I could cope with that in economy. Previously, I have travelled straight through, but I was working and earning good money then. For two people travelling the money saved would pay for a few hotels and car hire.

*** Also mulling over a trip to Northern Queensland, via either Singapore or probably Jakarta as that is closer to Cairns.

It's awful getting old, but it's better than the alternative.

Funnily enough, that's the same travel plan we used when going to see my Aunt near Perth. We had about 5 days in Singapore and had a great time. Western Australia is just paradise, but next time we plan to see other parts of Australia.


At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return.

How on earth do you get prices like that? Details, please!! I've only travelled business when offered a cheapish upgrade but plan to use it more in the future. But with Emirates, the cost was far higher!!

Steve

[BullDog]

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return.

How on earth do you get prices like that? Details, please!! I've only travelled business when offered a cheapish upgrade but plan to use it more in the future. But with Emirates, the cost was far higher!!

Steve

Presently, there's flights with various Star Alliance operators Manchester to Singapore around/just over £1800. Many of them are Lufthansa or Swiss Air tickets on Singapore Airlines flights. Looking a bit closer, quite a few have unrealistically short connecting times so I wouldn't book them. I won't book anything less than a 2 hour connection between flights. Finn Air have a similar deal but again, a stupid 40 minute connection. These are flights in February and anything can happen. In my experience, departure delays at Manchester are routine rather than the exception.

A little bit more expensive but the current favourite is Etihad, Manchester to Singapore for around £1900. Has a four hour connection time in Abu Dhabi which I find ideal. Time to have a shower and a meal in the lounge and an allowance for incompetence at Manchester Airport.

Onward next day economy flight Singapore to Perth is about £400 for sensible departure and arrival times with Qantas or Singapore Airlines. £300 is available for anti social flight timings. Not for me thanks.

A slight fly in the ointment is the Changi Airport transit hotel already looks fully booked.

All those flights are findable at Kayak or Google Flights. Some are through travel agents. I prefer to book with the carrier if possible.

Finally, London to Perth direct is around £4500. But I hate Heathrow and won't go there. Manchester to Perth with Emirates and Qatar Airways is likewise £4000 to £4500 for Q1 23 flights.

[stevensfo]

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return.

How on earth do you get prices like that? Details, please!! I've only travelled business when offered a cheapish upgrade but plan to use it more in the future. But with Emirates, the cost was far higher!!

Steve

Presently, there's flights with various Star Alliance operators Manchester to Singapore around/just over £1800. Many of them are Lufthansa or Swiss Air tickets on Singapore Airlines flights. Looking a bit closer, quite a few have unrealistically short connecting times so I wouldn't book them. I won't book anything less than a 2 hour connection between flights. Finn Air have a similar deal but again, a stupid 40 minute connection. These are flights in February and anything can happen. In my experience, departure delays at Manchester are routine rather than the exception.

A little bit more expensive but the current favourite is Etihad, Manchester to Singapore for around £1900. Has a four hour connection time in Abu Dhabi which I find ideal. Time to have a shower and a meal in the lounge and an allowance for incompetence at Manchester Airport.

Onward next day economy flight Singapore to Perth is about £400 for sensible departure and arrival times with Qantas or Singapore Airlines. £300 is available for anti social flight timings. Not for me thanks.

A slight fly in the ointment is the Changi Airport transit hotel already looks fully booked.

All those flights are findable at Kayak or Google Flights. Some are through travel agents. I prefer to book with the carrier if possible.

Finally, London to Perth direct is around £4500. But I hate Heathrow and won't go there. Manchester to Perth with Emirates and Qatar Airways is likewise £4000 to £4500 for Q1 23 flights.

Thanks for all this info. Etihad looks interesting. I believe they're pretty much identical to Emirates and Qatar in quality. I've used both and those large Airbus 380s are amazing. Only my wife has used business class on them, and I'm green with envy. The only thing I don't like about Emirates is the size of Dubai airport. It's like a small city!

Re. Changi, perhaps you could have a few days in Singapore? When we were there, we wanted to take a bus trip to a famous town just across the border with Malaysia. Can't remember the name of the place, but the trips were only twice a week and we missed it.

Agree about anti-social timings. When we were younger, it wasn't so bad, but these days I really don't want to have to get up at 4am, just cos Ryanair has a cheap flight leaving at 7am.

Steve

[Dod101]

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return.

How on earth do you get prices like that? Details, please!! I've only travelled business when offered a cheapish upgrade but plan to use it more in the future. But with Emirates, the cost was far higher!!

Steve

Presently, there's flights with various Star Alliance operators Manchester to Singapore around/just over £1800. Many of them are Lufthansa or Swiss Air tickets on Singapore Airlines flights. Looking a bit closer, quite a few have unrealistically short connecting times so I wouldn't book them. I won't book anything less than a 2 hour connection between flights. Finn Air have a similar deal but again, a stupid 40 minute connection. These are flights in February and anything can happen. In my experience, departure delays at Manchester are routine rather than the exception.

A little bit more expensive but the current favourite is Etihad, Manchester to Singapore for around £1900. Has a four hour connection time in Abu Dhabi which I find ideal. Time to have a shower and a meal in the lounge and an allowance for incompetence at Manchester Airport.

Onward next day economy flight Singapore to Perth is about £400 for sensible departure and arrival times with Qantas or Singapore Airlines. £300 is available for anti social flight timings. Not for me thanks.

A slight fly in the ointment is the Changi Airport transit hotel already looks fully booked.

All those flights are findable at Kayak or Google Flights. Some are through travel agents. I prefer to book with the carrier if possible.

Finally, London to Perth direct is around £4500. But I hate Heathrow and won't go there. Manchester to Perth with Emirates and Qatar Airways is likewise £4000 to £4500 for Q1 23 flights.

Goodness me. All these likes and dislikes. No wonder it costs you a fortune to get anywhere. I would never get up at 4 am for an early flight but I do not care about much else and just go with the flow. And I am not young.

Dod

[BullDog]

At the moment - I think it's looking favourite to book Manchester to Singapore in business class. Around £1800 return.

How on earth do you get prices like that? Details, please!! I've only travelled business when offered a cheapish upgrade but plan to use it more in the future. But with Emirates, the cost was far higher!!

Steve

Presently, there's flights with various Star Alliance operators Manchester to Singapore around/just over £1800. Many of them are Lufthansa or Swiss Air tickets on Singapore Airlines flights. Looking a bit closer, quite a few have unrealistically short connecting times so I wouldn't book them. I won't book anything less than a 2 hour connection between flights. Finn Air have a similar deal but again, a stupid 40 minute connection. These are flights in February and anything can happen. In my experience, departure delays at Manchester are routine rather than the exception.

A little bit more expensive but the current favourite is Etihad, Manchester to Singapore for around £1900. Has a four hour connection time in Abu Dhabi which I find ideal. Time to have a shower and a meal in the lounge and an allowance for incompetence at Manchester Airport.

Onward next day economy flight Singapore to Perth is about £400 for sensible departure and arrival times with Qantas or Singapore Airlines. £300 is available for anti social flight timings. Not for me thanks.

A slight fly in the ointment is the Changi Airport transit hotel already looks fully booked.

All those flights are findable at Kayak or Google Flights. Some are through travel agents. I prefer to book with the carrier if possible.

Finally, London to Perth direct is around £4500. But I hate Heathrow and won't go there. Manchester to Perth with Emirates and Qatar Airways is likewise £4000 to £4500 for Q1 23 flights.

Thanks for all this info. Etihad looks interesting. I believe they're pretty much identical to Emirates and Qatar in quality. I've used both and those large Airbus 380s are amazing. Only my wife has used business class on them, and I'm green with envy. The only thing I don't like about Emirates is the size of Dubai airport. It's like a small city!

Re. Changi, perhaps you could have a few days in Singapore? When we were there, we wanted to take a bus trip to a famous town just across the border with Malaysia. Can't remember the name of the place, but the trips were only twice a week and we missed it.

Agree about anti-social timings. When we were younger, it wasn't so bad, but these days I really don't want to have to get up at 4am, just cos Ryanair has a cheap flight leaving at 7am.

Steve

Thanks. I have flown to Perth, Sydney, Brisbane with all the big names but not yet Etihad. Like me, you prefer the A380 experience, it seems. But most of the airlines are decommissioning them. I think there's only Emirates who have a long term commitment to flying the A380. That's a very big backward step for the industry but it's all about money and the A380 is very expensive to operate. Nothing's quite the same as an hour or so socialising in the bar area of an A380 before getting some sleep. I don't know if Etihad are operating A380 on the route to Singapore. I would check on that. The A350 that's often being used now in place of the A380 isn't anything like as good. My last Perth trip was with Qatar Airlines on an A350, not a patch of the A380 for comfort. Of course, Australia has been locked down the last two years anyway, sadly.

[Newroad]

Hi BullDog et al.

In the last decade I have flown on the following Business Class to Perth, usually for two or so weeks

Qantas (0 stops)
Singapore Airlines (1 stop)
Thai Airways (1 stop)
Oman Air (2 stops, KL to Perth on a Malaysian Airlines codeshare)

I am shortly about to do the same on Qatar Airways (booked at Christmas, sub £4K) and am deliberately flying different planes on different legs to see what they are like. The new'ish Q-Suite is allegedly very good.

In general, they are all decent IMO (so, I largely concern myself with price). The Qantas direct flight I would argue is the best, all things being equal. Oman Air was the least expensive at the time (sub £3K). I don't particularly like the layout of Bangkok airport - can be a bit of a crush in the middle as you transit.

When I'm out there for longer, I usually fly economy (the extra day or two to recover is then less important).

Regards, Newroad