Nuisance Phone Calls

[tjh290633]

Will your face masks be yellow with the image of a lemon, as with our badges?

TJH

[PinkDalek]

Will your face masks be yellow with the image of a lemon, as with our badges?

I think we might be going somewhat off-topic but you might need to contact the kind provider of the originals for a source or maybe even another fellow Mod who may have some contacts (and if he is to be a supplier, that may ensure his return attendance)

Nuisance calls: Yeah we had one the other week. Nothing new to see here.

[Bouleversee]

I almost never get these calls, but when I do I try to string them along for as long as possible. Asking them random questions which bear no relationship to anything seems to work quite well: "how long is it?", "I dont know if tuesday is the best day?", "could you explain that again?"

You couldn't do that with the Amazon Prime One as you get a recorded message at first and are invited to click on a number, which I would never do. I keep them hanging on in silence till they cut off so their phone bill gets charged as long as possible.

My Amazon Prime calls resumed today; I had 2 this morning, though I don't even have an account. I always report them to 1572 so they get redirected but that only lasts till they come up with a different number. You would think that the powers that be could have come up with a way of blocking all unrecognisable numbers by now.

[Alaric]

I always report them to 1572 so they get redirected but that only lasts till they come up with a different number. You would think that the powers that be could have come up with a way of blocking all unrecognisable numbers by now.

I've reported so many on 1572 that the BT service says it's full. It offers me an option to remove the least used number, but invariably that's the one before the current one.

[monabri]

Hopefully when 5G is rolled out in my area with unlimited data I will be able to dump my BT landline forever. Part of the deal with broadband seems to be that we pay BT for a landline and in return we get(i) a mediocre heavily contended (shared) broadband line and (ii) "open access" (!) to nuisance phone calls from abroad where they can ignore TPS or whatever it is called. What have BT done to screen nuisance calls? They could automate the system such that if 50 people dialled a 4 digit number in response to a nuisance call, the nuisance call number would be suspended. Instead we suffer the nuisance calls and BT provides a route into our lives for these nuisance calls. We are thus paying for someone to annoy us!

[Alaric]

They could automate the system such that if 50 people dialled a 4 digit number in response to a nuisance call, the nuisance call number would be suspended. Instead we suffer the nuisance calls and BT provides a route into our lives for these nuisance calls. We are thus paying for someone to annoy us!

The problem that they are unable or unwilling to solve is that the callers use a fake number which changes frequently. The system knows it's a fake if you try to call it back, but doesn't block the call automatically.

[AF62]

What have BT done to screen nuisance calls?

Well they will sell you a phone which blocks nuisance calls...

Seriously, just buy one and the unwanted calls vanish.

[Alaric]

Well they will sell you a phone which blocks nuisance calls...

Is that why they don't build the technology to do this into the network itself?

[yorkshirelad1]

Hopefully when 5G is rolled out in my area with unlimited data I will be able to dump my BT landline forever. Part of the deal with broadband seems to be that we pay BT for a landline and in return we get(i) a mediocre heavily contended (shared) broadband line and (ii) "open access" (!) to nuisance phone calls from abroad where they can ignore TPS or whatever it is called. What have BT done to screen nuisance calls? They could automate the system such that if 50 people dialled a 4 digit number in response to a nuisance call, the nuisance call number would be suspended. Instead we suffer the nuisance calls and BT provides a route into our lives for these nuisance calls. We are thus paying for someone to annoy us!

Cold calls are not limited to BT landlines. Those nice people wanting to get at your hard earned cash and/or computer also include mobile numbers in their calling lists!

[ReformedCharacter]

They could automate the system such that if 50 people dialled a 4 digit number in response to a nuisance call, the nuisance call number would be suspended. Instead we suffer the nuisance calls and BT provides a route into our lives for these nuisance calls. We are thus paying for someone to annoy us!

The problem that they are unable or unwilling to solve is that the callers use a fake number which changes frequently. The system knows it's a fake if you try to call it back, but doesn't block the call automatically.

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking. I haven't tried a BT 'phone that supposedly blocks scam calls but I assume it checks the incoming Caller ID against a database of known scammers but I have doubts whether this would be 100% effective because of the ease of creating fake Caller IDs possibly for each call.

RC

[swill453]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Strikes me the system could have been designed to get round these issues. But it wasn't.

Scott.

[Alaric]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call.

That's the general idea.

Blocking where there's no caller ID is already supported, is it not? That's why they use a fake. In some shape or form establish whether a number is genuine by means of a dummy call back. Relying on a database of fake numbers doesn't work. A database of genuine numbers could work but perhaps too expensive an undertaking.

[ReformedCharacter]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Strikes me the system could have been designed to get round these issues. But it wasn't.

Scott.

The same could be said for the Internet, email etc.

RC

[ReformedCharacter]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call.

That's the general idea.

Blocking where there's no caller ID is already supported, is it not? That's why they use a fake. In some shape or form establish whether a number is genuine by means of a dummy call back. Relying on a database of fake numbers doesn't work. A database of genuine numbers could work but perhaps too expensive an undertaking.

Blocking where there is no Caller ID (or presentation number as I believe it is called) is a simple thing but I've certainly received plenty of legitimate calls where no Caller ID is shown (my GP's surgery being one example, in the past) these are often from systems that use IP telephony and where the operator has chosen not to supply a presentation number for whatever reason.

RC

[Infrasonic]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Strikes me the system could have been designed to get round these issues. But it wasn't.

Scott.

The same could be said for the Internet, email etc.

RC

The only spam I get delivered to me these days on Outlook.live.com has an SPF record, DKIM, quite often a DMARC policy and ARC (forwarding authentication) pass, and isn't even scoring high on the spam traps. Plenty of phishing email clones coming from behind legitimate domains like Azure, Google, Amazon et al.

There's been loads of issues with legitimate email deliverability as the authenitication systems have been ramped up by the big players (Google, MS, Yahoo et al), and they keep adding layers to them (BIMI was a recent new one on me). Companies like MXToolbox have built a good business out of monitoring deliverability, configuration issues, blacklists etc.

I missed an arranged NHS consultant call the other week as my phone had inadvertantly slipped into do not disturb and was only whitelisting a select few numbers. All my NHS calls come up as 'private number' these days with a voicemail message to the switchboard / secretary numbers if missed.

[mc2fool]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Uh? But the system knows what the real calling number is (at least for calls originating in the UK), so the solution is, at least in concept, quite simple: only real numbers (or blocks of) that have been previously registered to do so can provide an alternative caller ID, and that has to be a pre-registered real number.

[Infrasonic]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Uh? But the system knows what the real calling number is (at least for calls originating in the UK), so the solution is, at least in concept, quite simple: only real numbers (or blocks of) that have been previously registered to do so can provide an alternative caller ID, and that has to be a pre-registered real number.

Wasn't that the idea behind what HMRC were trialling to stop spoofed calls?

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/cont ... ofing-hmrc

[Alaric]

But the system knows what the real calling number is (at least for calls originating in the UK),

Calls purporting to come from from Windows, BT, Amazon etc. don't usually originate in the UK and are suspected as coming from Indian call centres. From the appalling sound quality, many may be using Skype or similar.

[swill453]

But the system knows what the real calling number is (at least for calls originating in the UK),

Calls purporting to come from from Windows, BT, Amazon etc. don't usually originate in the UK and are suspected as coming from Indian call centres. From the appalling sound quality, many may be using Skype or similar.

So do these have fake UK Caller Id? That shouldn't be allowed, and should be simple for the system to prevent.

(I don't know if they do, I have a phone that screens calls. Haven't had a nuisance call in years.)

Scott.

[ReformedCharacter]

I think we've had this discussion before, the 'system' doesn't know anything about fakes when you try to call back, it just cannot connect. You seem to be asking for a system that would verify the caller's apparent Caller ID (if supplied, and not all calls are - even legitimate ones) for each call. Since the nuisance callers can create a new fake Caller ID for each call that would be a major and probably impractical undertaking.

Uh? But the system knows what the real calling number is (at least for calls originating in the UK), so the solution is, at least in concept, quite simple: only real numbers (or blocks of) that have been previously registered to do so can provide an alternative caller ID, and that has to be a pre-registered real number.

That doesn't sound simple to do. And what about IP telephony where there is no 'real number'? And who is going to take care of the 'registration' and administer what would be quite a large database? That's before trying to filter international calls, like those call centres in India...

RC