HiFi buffs? A small but good HiFi system?

[stevensfo]

Moderator Message:
Moved to Computers etc, as better suited to discussion. (There's a related topic here at https://lemonfool.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=26019) (chas49)

I grew up in the days when newsagents were full of 'What HiFi' and other magazines rambling on and on about amplifiers, speaker power, gold or copper wires, which record player, best stylus, TDK vs Maxell cassettes etc, my Dad had speakers only found these days on a stage and I had a snooty friend who swore that his old inherited valve amplifier was superior to everything else.

Decades later, both kids are out of the house (haven't changed the locks yet) and I want to reclaim my territory. Up to now, apart from our phones, we play Christmas carols through the TV and other music via a simple 'ghetto blaster' thingy that sits in the corner of the kitchen.

So I'm looking for a good, powerful, preferably compact music centre, that plays CDs and mp3s (USB stick) with speakers that sound brilliant. Also, is there an optimum distance for placing speakers apart? I think I heard somewhere that it's not as important as it used to be.

Any ideas?


Steve

[swill453]

Definitely not a HiFi buff, but I'm still impressed by the sound quality of the Sony soundbar and subwoofer combination I have attached to my television.

Streaming stuff via the Chromecast on the telly, or via Bluetooth from my Amazon Echo, meets my needs, and is as good as any HiFi I've had in the past (which were admittedly not hugely high end).

Scott.

[Itsallaguess]

We play Christmas carols through the TV

Definitely not a HiFi buff, but I'm still impressed by the sound quality of the Sony soundbar and subwoofer combination I have attached to my television.

Streaming stuff via the Chromecast on the telly, or via Bluetooth from my Amazon Echo, meets my needs, and is as good as any HiFi I've had in the past (which were admittedly not hugely high end).

That was going to be the heading I was going to suggest too, but by way of asking stevensfo what 'through the TV' really meant, first.

If he really does mean the actual TV speakers, then I would also steer any overall solution to the 'music' issue towards a 'Home Theatre' solution of some sort, that would not only provide a huge initial benefit to the use of the TV itself, but also, as swill has said, deliver good secondary opportunities for music play-back too...

A good sound-bar and small sub-woofer, perhaps ensuring that there's both AUX-IN and also Bluetooth play-back opportunities on it as well, will probably provide a relatively cheap but substantial solution, with more expensive options being available too, of course, incorporating things like more expensive AV Receivers and 5.1/7.1 speaker systems, but I'd start at the sound-bar/sub-woofer end and do some initial research and perhaps demo a few as well...

Some time investigating requirements and solutions will be time well spent with this sort of thing...

Sounds like something for the Christmas list!

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

[redsturgeon]

You haven't mentioned budget.

John

[redsturgeon]

I've always been tempted by these

https://www.brennan.co.uk/

And I already have Sonos which is great.

John

[Watis]

Another cautious vote for Sonos.

I have a Playbar for the TV and music, and a Play 5 speaker (in another room).

Cautious because Sonos recently declared a range of products - including the earlier Play 5 - obsolete. The reason given is that their processors cannot handle the latest improvements to the system.

The resultant outcry led them to release a second app which can be used with these earlier products. However, that means that I can no longer group the Playbar and the Play 5 to play the same music.

The sound quality is superb but, once bitten . . .

Watis

[stevensfo]

We play Christmas carols through the TV

Definitely not a HiFi buff, but I'm still impressed by the sound quality of the Sony soundbar and subwoofer combination I have attached to my television.

Streaming stuff via the Chromecast on the telly, or via Bluetooth from my Amazon Echo, meets my needs, and is as good as any HiFi I've had in the past (which were admittedly not hugely high end).

That was going to be the heading I was going to suggest too, but by way of asking stevensfo what 'through the TV' really meant, first.

Itsallaguess

Please don't laugh, but we just use our son's very old XBox. The DVD/CD part of our Panasonic dual VHS/DVD player broke a long time ago. Also, we tend to do this only at Christmas time when relatives flock round.

However, we're not great TV watchers and in any case, I want the HiFi system in a completely different room. We all have extremely different tastes in music 'and' TV.

So basically, I'd like a smallish standalone system but with decent speakers that sound good with all music. Prepared to pay above average. Depending on mood, I can listen to anything from Punk to Heavy Metal to Medieval Motets. In fact anything except Rap, which tends to give me a headache. I have enough of that sort of thing from my wife.

Steve

[scrumpyjack]

I got recently the Edifier S3000 Pro. It is very good

Every type of input so use it linked by Bluetooth to my Ipad, by optical to the TV and by line in to the PC

Very satisfied with it

[fisher]

My father had a Brennan (https://www.brennan.co.uk/) and loved it. Converts your CDs automatically to its internal hard drive. It used to be as 320kbps mp3 but it may also offer lossless now. Can take your USB stick and copy that to its internal hard drive too. It's a CD ripper and amplifier all in one. Fairly good sound reproduction, very compact box. You'd need to research and buy some speakers elsewhere - look at Tannoy, Mordaunt Short, Monitor Audio amongst others - it all depends on your budget and I'm a little out of date on it all now. There will be plenty of online reviews for speakers at various price points.

If you want to go further, then I am a big fan of Denon. They do a compact CD transport (https://www.denon.com/en-gb/shop/cdsacdplayer/dcd50), matching amplifier (https://www.denon.com/en-gb/shop/denond ... ries/pma60 or https://www.denon.com/en-gb/shop/denond ... ries/pma30) - see https://www.denon.com/en-gb/category/hi ... signseries for the entire range.

They do support Bluetooth playback but I don't think you can just plug in your USB stick.
Again, read reviews as I'm not up to date on their latest offerings but they always had a good reputation and all my amplifiers are Denon.

Add speakers to this.

There will be other decent mini systems from other manufacturers too.

[Watis]

My father had a Brennan (https://www.brennan.co.uk/) and loved it. Converts your CDs automatically to its internal hard drive. It used to be as 320kbps mp3 but it may also offer lossless now. Can take your USB stick and copy that to its internal hard drive too. It's a CD ripper and amplifier all in one. Fairly good sound reproduction, very compact box. You'd need to research and buy some speakers elsewhere - look at Tannoy, Mordaunt Short, Monitor Audio amongst others - it all depends on your budget and I'm a little out of date on it all now. There will be plenty of online reviews for speakers at various price points.

<snip>

It may not be well known, but the Brennan device is built around the Raspberry Pi.

https://www.brennan.co.uk/itemcontent.php/content/Techy

Watis

[Gerry557]

If you have been happy with TV speakers then you can be impressed quite cheaply

Have a look at something like the £250 Denon dm 41. A mini hi fi and well regarded in your what hi fi magazine. You can just buy the box and choose you own speakers.

How big is the room? Where would you put and have space for speakers. Floorstanders or book shelves on stands

You can buy some second had speakers too. Someone upgrading might offer a cheaper route

You need to think about a budget ballpark. No point recommending £5k speakers if you are thinking £1500 tops.

Monitor Audio have silver or cheaper bronze ranges or kef. Amps budget from £300 but get more wowey at £1500. Audiolab 6000 play might be a very good mid range option.

Lifestyle also play a part and if you want to hook up to TV, which I would recommend and or Bluetooth from phones, plex or various other options.

I will see if your mag recommends a budget mid high option and get back to you later

[stevensfo]

If you have been happy with TV speakers then you can be impressed quite cheaply

Have a look at something like the £250 Denon dm 41. A mini hi fi and well regarded in your what hi fi magazine. You can just buy the box and choose you own speakers.

How big is the room? Where would you put and have space for speakers. Floorstanders or book shelves on stands

You can buy some second had speakers too. Someone upgrading might offer a cheaper route

You need to think about a budget ballpark. No point recommending £5k speakers if you are thinking £1500 tops.

Monitor Audio have silver or cheaper bronze ranges or kef. Amps budget from £300 but get more wowey at £1500. Audiolab 6000 play might be a very good mid range option.

Lifestyle also play a part and if you want to hook up to TV, which I would recommend and or Bluetooth from phones, plex or various other options.

I will see if your mag recommends a budget mid high option and get back to you later

Thanks Gerry. Budget max probably about 1000. The TV speakers are used for what I call rubbishy background music and even if they were good speakers, I will have the HiFi system in a different room. As far as I can see, the Denon DM41does not have a port for a USB stick. I have a huge collection of mp3s so that is a must. Apart from CD and USB input, I'm not interested in streaming, Bluetooth etc and certainly not into telling Alexa what to play! Knowing my luck, she'd probably argue with me!

Steve

[Mike4]

I have a huge collection of mp3s so that is a must.
Steve

What bitrate are most of them recorded at?

I ask because older MP3s are likely to be 128kbps and their quality will seem disappointingly poor played on good hifi, so don't buy anything too good!

[fisher]

I have a huge collection of mp3s so that is a must.
Steve

What bitrate are most of them recorded at?

I ask because older MP3s are likely to be 128kbps and their quality will seem disappointingly poor played on good hifi, so don't buy anything too good!

Conversley, if the mp3s are at 224 kbps or above then they're probably hard to distinguish from the original CDs.

The brennan referenced earlier with a decent set of 3rd party speakers could well be a good fit. You could copy your entire set of mp3s to it so you don't need to worry about usb sticks in future. You can't play CDs directly (unless that's been updated in the last few years), but you can rip them to its hard drive and then play them from that. They have a 2tb hard drive option which would hold a lot of music.

[stevensfo]

I have a huge collection of mp3s so that is a must.
Steve

What bitrate are most of them recorded at?

I ask because older MP3s are likely to be 128kbps and their quality will seem disappointingly poor played on good hifi, so don't buy anything too good!

Whoops! Blush time again. Yes, most of my collection dates from over ten years ago and a quick check reveals that they are mainly 128kbps with some over 200 kbps.

However, with the kids gone (most of the time) I will have chance to concentrate on refining my taste...or ears!

Steve

[stevensfo]

I have a huge collection of mp3s so that is a must.
Steve

What bitrate are most of them recorded at?

I ask because older MP3s are likely to be 128kbps and their quality will seem disappointingly poor played on good hifi, so don't buy anything too good!

Conversley, if the mp3s are at 224 kbps or above then they're probably hard to distinguish from the original CDs.

The brennan referenced earlier with a decent set of 3rd party speakers could well be a good fit. You could copy your entire set of mp3s to it so you don't need to worry about usb sticks in future. You can't play CDs directly (unless that's been updated in the last few years), but you can rip them to its hard drive and then play them from that. They have a 2tb hard drive option which would hold a lot of music.

I have to admit that the Brennan 2 does look easy to use and, looking at their website, I like the idea of ripping CDs and lossless mp3 quality. But it outputs only 15W to the speakers. Is this sufficient? I always believed that higher power made better use of the speakers and I dimly remember that 40W was the minimum required for a decent sound in the average living room. As a young nipper, I'm sure that my Dad never had the volume dial more than half way for a 'very' loud sound. But that was a long time ago!

Steve

[PhaseThree]

Recovering HiFi Buff here .... (My main system costs more than a typical family car etc.)...

A friend and fellow recovering HiFi nut has recently bought a couple of these things for his office and second home :-
https://www.technics.com/uk/products/pr ... c-c70.html

From what I have heard of them I am very impressed, and they tick all the boxes you have mentioned and few more beside.
If you want music rather than sound I would suggest giving them a try - John Lewis and Richer Sounds stock them.

[Lanark]

With HiFi systems in the sub £1000 range you can generally pick any two out of Small, Inexpensive and Good sounding.

Almost any used set of 1980s or 90s Hi Fi Separates will be Inexpensive + Good sounding but they tend to be hideous to look at.

I would advise against Sonos, I think they look cheap and sound terrible - at least try to hear a demo before committing yourself.

if this system is just for you - think about a headphone only system: good CD player + headphone amp + headphones, you can get a GREAT sound for not much outlay. and you don't need a big amplifier and speakers cluttering up the room.

[tikunetih]

Have a look at something like the £250 Denon dm 41. A mini hi fi and well regarded in your what hi fi magazine. You can just buy the box and choose you own speakers.

These Denon micro systems are excellent: fantastic value and sound and look good. I'd start with that as the "default" option which to compare alternatives to - you'll struggle to beat it on a bang-for-your-buck basis.

Another alternative is a bunch of smart speakers, with Sonos, Google/Nest and Amazon being the obvious choices. Key with these is the convenience and availability: for many of us music is primarily a background not a foreground experience - we don't that often sit down to listen to an album in the way we'd watch a film - so the easier it is to listen to your music the more music you'll listen to. Having a bunch of smart speakers dotted around various rooms that you can control from your phone or other device or your voice, even if their audio quality isn't top hifi quality, can for many people be preferable to a better sounding but solo hifi that's anchored in one room and that's much less convenient to operate.

Testimony to that is that I've a bunch of fancy Linn separates and speakers up in my loft in their boxes, while dotted around the house in various rooms are a bunch of unobtrusive Sonos and Google smart speakers plus a Chromecast wired to a TV soundbar. As a result, I listen to far more music than I ever did previously. NB a couple of Sonos 1s in a stereo pair, mounted on stands, (optionally with a sub) do the trick if I do want to just sit and listen to an album, as I might've done back in the day with the proper hifi - sure, it doesn't sound quite as good as that used to, but it's 90% there, surprisingly competent, and plenty good enough for most people I'm sure. Remember, hifi buffs with their directional cables et al are all nutters.

[quelquod]

I have to admit that the Brennan 2 does look easy to use and, looking at their website, I like the idea of ripping CDs and lossless mp3 quality. But it outputs only 15W to the speakers. Is this sufficient? I always believed that higher power made better use of the speakers and I dimly remember that 40W was the minimum required for a decent sound in the average living room. As a young nipper, I'm sure that my Dad never had the volume dial more than half way for a 'very' loud sound. But that was a long time ago!

Steve

Well the volume control setting isn’t directly a measure of the proportion of amplifier output being used as it depends on the input level. Anyway as with everything in HiFi, it depends. Some less sensitive speakers need a lot of driving especially to achieve a decent frequency range in a small volume. Some music has a large dynamic range so to hear the quieter passages you need plenty of oomph in hand. My old system can run 200 watts rms per channel into a pair of B&W 801s but I expect on average it’s a lot nearer 2.

In practice most of my casual music listening comes from a Raspberry Pi and a matchbox-sized amplifier playing mp3s through wireless headphones. (No highs, no lows, it’s Bose, but my hearing isn’t what it was!)