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Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

Does what it says on the tin
Clariman
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Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307134

Postby Clariman » May 10th, 2020, 8:52 am

I've bought and assembled this rose arch https://www.wayfair.co.uk/garden/pdp/sy ... x1806.html

However, I am wondering about how to secure it into the ground. The spec said that its installation type was "staked into the ground". I assumed this meant that the arch would have shaped ends to allow it to be driven into the ground but it doesn't - it is just the round bamboo.

Can I dig holes and drive it into them or do I need to buy some metal spikes? Most spikes I can find on Amazon are for square fence posts of 100x100 mm or similar. The arch has round legs. I'll need to check the dimensions, but I'd guess a 40 to 50mm diameter.

Advice appreciated thanks.

Clariman

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307144

Postby bungeejumper » May 10th, 2020, 9:28 am

If it's bamboo, I'd just sink the four holes and drop it in. (With metal I'd have gone the full monty and concreted it into position, because I'd be planning for 15-20 year payback.)

I would, however, do two things. First, I'd soak the bamboo ends in wood preservative, which will buy you many years of extra longevity. And secondly, I'd drop some postcard-sized flat stones down the four holes so as to ensure that it wouldn't sink into the ground in a lopsided way.

If you're planning to have a fairly meaty rose on your arch, you may still want to consider a concrete base for the four legs. Those things can become a force of nature in time! :lol:

BJ

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307145

Postby Itsallaguess » May 10th, 2020, 9:34 am

Clariman wrote:
I've bought and assembled this rose arch https://www.wayfair.co.uk/garden/pdp/sy ... x1806.html

However, I am wondering about how to secure it into the ground. The spec said that its installation type was "staked into the ground". I assumed this meant that the arch would have shaped ends to allow it to be driven into the ground but it doesn't - it is just the round bamboo.

Can I dig holes and drive it into them or do I need to buy some metal spikes? Most spikes I can find on Amazon are for square fence posts of 100x100 mm or similar. The arch has round legs. I'll need to check the dimensions, but I'd guess a 40 to 50mm diameter.


You could dig holes for the four arch legs, but I'd be bothered about then losing some height in the arch, and perhaps more importantly having the legs buried under damp ground for much of the year, and there's the added complication that you'd still not really have a great way to achieve a good tight hole, because the only thing you'd ultimately be able to do that would achieve one in soil would be to 'tamp' the ground around any hole you might dig - as there doesn't look to be a good way to use the arch body itself to achieve a good 'hammer' into the ground without damaging it...

So - I'd get something that you can hammer in, and then secure the arch to that...

This would solve both of the above issues, allowing you to maintain as much visible height of the arch as possible, as you don't need to 'bury' any of it, and it would also allow you to achieve the best possible secure fixing into the ground itself, as you'd be using something designed specifically to do that...

Metal fence-spikes might look to be overkill for this application, and is also likely to provide a poor solution anyway, given the round legs of the arch and the relatively small diameter of them, so here's some examples of what you might be able to use for this -

Blooma Fixing spike (450mm x 31mm x 31mm - pressure treated) - £2 from B&Q - https://www.diy.com/departments/blooma-fixing-spike/1906481_BQ.prd

Fixing Spike (450mm x 31mm x 31mm- pressure treated) - 79p from B&M - https://www.bmstores.co.uk/products/fixing-spike-450mm-265770

The above are only shown as examples, and noting that you say the legs of the arch are around 40-50mm in diameter, then I'd probably be looking for a 50mm wide version of the above wooden spikes, rather than the 31mm square ones in these examples, but you could perhaps make a different judgement call. I bought some 50mm pressure-treated ones from a local wood-yard for pennies last year, and they're likely to offer better value than the above examples if you've got a local one you can have a look around...

Something around a 450mm height for such spikes would seem to give a good half-in/half-out solution, where 225mm hammered into the ground (with a small amount of hole-prep initially, I would imagine..), and with 225mm above the ground to then fix the arch-legs onto, would probably give a good secure solution when used with four spikes.

I'd probably then use three or four good, solid tie-wraps (not the normal 4.5mm ones...) on each leg to then secure the arch legs to the wooden spikes, with Screwfix coming to the rescue there -

7.5mm wide tie-wraps - https://www.screwfix.com/p/cable-ties-black-370-x-7-5mm-pack-of-100/24453

9mm wide tie-wraps - https://www.screwfix.com/p/cable-ties-black-550-x-9mm-pack-of-100/75152

Four large hose-clips could be also be used (one for each leg..) if you're really wanting to go to town whilst still maintaining a non-screw solution to fixing the legs to the spikes -

https://www.screwfix.com/p/t-mex-stainless-steel-worm-drive-hose-clips-70-120mm-10-pack/28347

I'd prefer to spend a little extra and achieve that 'non-screw' fixing solution myself, but you could always just screw straight through the arch legs and into the fixing spikes if you'd prefer not to spend too much extra on the above...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307151

Postby bungeejumper » May 10th, 2020, 9:44 am

Whoops, I've just seen that the overall height of this arch is 187cm, which is 73 inches. Which means that dropping it six inches into the soil isn't an option unless all your visitors are of Napoleonic stature. ;) So fixing spikes, as IAAG suggests, would probably be the better way to go.

BJ

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307159

Postby kiloran » May 10th, 2020, 10:12 am

I used treated wooden plant stakes (about 2.5cm sq) postcreted into the ground, with the top of the postcrete just above ground level, and about 6cm of the stake above ground, then attached the archway to the 4 stakes. The archway is then above ground so should not rot.

--kiloran

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307197

Postby Clariman » May 10th, 2020, 11:38 am

Thanks everyone. Do you think that these might do the job?

https://www.amazon.co.uk/300mm-TREATED- ... 0749KGX88/

The diameter of the bamboo footing is about 35mm. These stakes are 25mm square. They are only 12 inches long but I could put one on either side of each bamboo leg, so have it secured by 8 of these.

Thoughts?

Thanks
C

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307198

Postby genou » May 10th, 2020, 11:41 am

Clariman wrote:Thanks everyone. Do you think that these might do the job?

The diameter of the bamboo footing is about 35mm. These stakes are 25mm square. They are only 12 inches long but I could put one on either side of each bamboo leg, so have it secured by 8 of these.

Thoughts?

Thanks
C

Think you may have missed a link.
If the bamboo is hollow, could you not just drive some rebar into the ground and drop the legs over them?

Clariman
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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307203

Postby Clariman » May 10th, 2020, 11:47 am

genou wrote:
Clariman wrote:Thanks everyone. Do you think that these might do the job?

The diameter of the bamboo footing is about 35mm. These stakes are 25mm square. They are only 12 inches long but I could put one on either side of each bamboo leg, so have it secured by 8 of these.

Thoughts?

Thanks
C

Think you may have missed a link.
If the bamboo is hollow, could you not just drive some rebar into the ground and drop the legs over them?


Oh thanks. I've edited my post to include the link. The stakes are here https://www.amazon.co.uk/300mm-TREATED- ... 0749KGX88/

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307208

Postby kiloran » May 10th, 2020, 11:58 am

Clariman wrote:Oh thanks. I've edited my post to include the link. The stakes are here https://www.amazon.co.uk/300mm-TREATED- ... 0749KGX88/

Intriguing..... according to that website, the stakes have been tantalized. In this modern world, you'd think we were above teasing wooden stakes :lol:

More seriously, using 8 seems a bit of an overkill to hold the archway.

--kiloran

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307245

Postby AsleepInYorkshire » May 10th, 2020, 1:41 pm

Clariman wrote:I've bought and assembled this rose arch https://www.wayfair.co.uk/garden/pdp/sy ... x1806.html

However, I am wondering about how to secure it into the ground. The spec said that its installation type was "staked into the ground". I assumed this meant that the arch would have shaped ends to allow it to be driven into the ground but it doesn't - it is just the round bamboo.

Can I dig holes and drive it into them or do I need to buy some metal spikes? Most spikes I can find on Amazon are for square fence posts of 100x100 mm or similar. The arch has round legs. I'll need to check the dimensions, but I'd guess a 40 to 50mm diameter.

Advice appreciated thanks.

Clariman

I wouldn't try and put them in the ground. I'd consider lifingt the ground up. Two planters (clay or ceramic?) 600mm long each and reasonably deep. Fill with single size clean coarse aggregates (so they bind together)

An example pic


Image

AiYn'U

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#307295

Postby dealtn » May 10th, 2020, 4:35 pm

I guess the "downstairs neighbours" wouldn't appreciate you digging them in in that instance either!

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#308261

Postby bionichamster » May 13th, 2020, 1:55 pm

If it were me I’d buy some metal pipe of the suitable diameter and place that in the ground either driven deep or concreted below soil level. Then insert the arbour legs in. you could pack out if the pipe is a little too big, or pare down the legs a few mm if opposite true. Alternatively I’d do the same with pipe in four pots. A bit of soil and some plants would hide the pipe above ground/pot

Lots of other options but that’d be my preference.

Permanence may not be an issue as I can’t imaging that sort of thing lasting more than a few years If it’s like most commonly available Outdoor garden ornamentation, so I wouldn’t spent to much. Therefore On reflection your stakes may be fine. Either cable tied or perhaps screwed if you dare.

BH

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#308326

Postby Mike88 » May 13th, 2020, 4:15 pm

bionichamster wrote:If it were me I’d buy some metal pipe of the suitable diameter and place that in the ground either driven deep or concreted below soil level. Then insert the arbour legs in. you could pack out if the pipe is a little too big, or pare down the legs a few mm if opposite true.
BH


That's a great idea except I would use plastic downpipe.

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#308381

Postby Clariman » May 13th, 2020, 7:04 pm

Thanks everyone. I installed it earlier today with 12" stakes. Ideally I would have liked something slightly larger but they have done the job well. Mind you, I doubled them up with 2 on each. Each pair and leg are held with 3 wide cable ties. It feels very secure but I'll keep you posted when we get the next gale force winds. The last one, cobbled together out of trellis, lasted more than 10 years so I'm hoping this lasts at least as long.

Thanks again
C

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#308402

Postby kiloran » May 13th, 2020, 7:57 pm

Clariman wrote:Thanks everyone. I installed it earlier today with 12" stakes. Ideally I would have liked something slightly larger but they have done the job well. Mind you, I doubled them up with 2 on each. Each pair and leg are held with 3 wide cable ties. It feels very secure but I'll keep you posted when we get the next gale force winds. The last one, cobbled together out of trellis, lasted more than 10 years so I'm hoping this lasts at least as long.

Thanks again
C

Just a thought... the cable ties are plastic, outside, under some strain, and perhaps in sunlight. I wonder if they might go brittle and snap over time?

--kiloran

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Re: Fixing a rose arch/arbour into the ground

#308408

Postby Clariman » May 13th, 2020, 8:20 pm

kiloran wrote:
Clariman wrote:Thanks everyone. I installed it earlier today with 12" stakes. Ideally I would have liked something slightly larger but they have done the job well. Mind you, I doubled them up with 2 on each. Each pair and leg are held with 3 wide cable ties. It feels very secure but I'll keep you posted when we get the next gale force winds. The last one, cobbled together out of trellis, lasted more than 10 years so I'm hoping this lasts at least as long.

Thanks again
C

Just a thought... the cable ties are plastic, outside, under some strain, and perhaps in sunlight. I wonder if they might go brittle and snap over time?

--kiloran

The ones I bought say they are suitable for outdoor use and UV resistant. We'll see.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B07R6SSGJH


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