The Lemon Fool

In some of my more recent rentals I've had over-enthusiastic smoke alarms (the worst would react to steam from the shower). Their redeeming feature is that they could easily be shut up.

Now I have a smoke alarm that occasionally goes off, and can't see any way to shut it up. Neither can others who have looked, including the man who installed my new boiler in February, and whose welding work set it off. But he did dislodge a label, which said don't use after (I think the year was) 2003!

It went off again this evening (I think for the first time since the boilerman). Probably my frying, though nothing came near to being burned. I really must rip the damn thing out. And it looks as if nothing short of ripping it (which will leave the ceiling in need of repair) will rid me of it.

I should probably replace it (I daresay Screwfix can flog me a new one with an off-switch), though I'm slightly in two minds. But I certainly don't want to find myself with a more over-enthusiastic nuisance! What should I look out for?

What make and model is it?

Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I've just bought two on Amazon to replace the five-year-old Fire Angle ones in my house that have recently started intermittently chirping, and don't have replaceable batts.

Edit to add: P.S. these are what I have, and they have never given me a false alarm even when I've burnt shiite in the kitchen!
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07 ... UTF8&psc=1

Mind you I've never stress-tested them with real smoke either....

Mike4 wrote:What make and model is it?

How would I know? Such logo as it may once have sported is long-since faded into obscurity!

Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I may have been too timid in my past attempts to do anything like that. Will revisit that line!

Edit to add: P.S. these are what I have, and they have never given me a false alarm even when I've burnt shiite in the kitchen!

Hmmm. If I actually burn something int the kitchen then it makes sense that it should sound the alarm - in case I'm upstairs and the burning smell has yet to reach me. Come to think of it, this one lets me down there too.

You could fit a heat alarm in the kitchen, rather than a smoke alarm. They don’t get set off by smoke, only by excessive heat. So the toaster or overenthusiastic caramelising of onions etc don’t trigger it, only when the temperature at the ceiling becomes excessive indicating a real danger.

For example:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/fireangel-ht-630r-10-year-life-heat-alarm/5256g#product_additional_details_container

Of course that won’t tell you that your rice is starting to overcook until the kitchen is actually in danger of bursting into flames.

UncleEbenezer wrote:

Mike4 wrote:Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I may have been too timid in my past attempts to do anything like that. Will revisit that line!

Now I recollect why I've been timid about it.

Might a smoke alarm be wired in to the mains, or are they all purely battery-operated?

UncleEbenezer wrote:

UncleEbenezer wrote:

Mike4 wrote:Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I may have been too timid in my past attempts to do anything like that. Will revisit that line!

Now I recollect why I've been timid about it.

Might a smoke alarm be wired in to the mains, or are they all purely battery-operated?

Yes, it might, especially in a newish property. Our 1988 new build didn't have mains connected ones, but a 1996 new build did (with a slide out tray for a 9v battery, presumably as back up in the event of a power failure).

Unfortunately, I don't think I ever tried removing it from the ceiling, but I'd imagine this type must also be in two parts, with a baseplate*, or they would be very tricky to wire in the first place.

*I guess they could be two part when new, but clip together in some tamper proof way to prevent unauthorised fiddling...

UncleEbenezer wrote:I should probably replace it

Understatement of the last two decades. The old ionisation ones had hardware (slightly radioactive, IIRC) that doesn't do much once it gets beyond its half-life.

Good luck with finding one that can be switched off. Our flat tenant would have loved one of those, because her alarm would go off every time she lit up a spliff, and she eventually resorted to removing the batteries. Which annoyed me almost as much as it would have upset the insurance company.

But I certainly don't want to find myself with a more over-enthusiastic nuisance! What should I look out for?

The only thing worse than an over-enthusiastic alarm is, yeah, you've guessed it. I think all the popular ones have gone over to optical these days. But there are leccy ones that are hard-wired in, and linked ones that will alert any nearby properties, and suchlike. If you've got a commercial premises on the ground floor, there may be special rules. Some introductory info at https://thesafegroup.co.uk/blog/what-ar ... oke-alarms.

BJ

bungeejumper wrote:Good luck with finding one that can be switched off.
BJ

That's not hard. For example, the one Mike linked to from Amazon has a reset button similar to those in my last two rental places (one of which was the one that thought my shower was burning).

UncleEbenezer wrote:That's not hard. For example, the one Mike linked to from Amazon has a reset button similar to those in my last two rental places (one of which was the one that thought my shower was burning).

Many of them have reset buttons. But the cabled-in variety have to be hard-wired (by a professional) so as to stop anything (or anyone) from putting them out of action. Again, there are special rules if commercial premises or HMOs (houses of multiple occupancy) are in the building. For most people, a good quality battery alarm, properly positioned, would be good enough.

BTW, forget what I just said about the half life of an old-style alarm's radioactive bit. The half life of americium-241 is 432 years. They're still serious about those use-by dates, though.

BJ

UncleEbenezer wrote:

Mike4 wrote:What make and model is it?

How would I know? Such logo as it may once have sported is long-since faded into obscurity!

This alone is reason to replace it. Model identifying markings don't fade with age. I'd say if yours has no identifying markings I'd say they were never present in the first place, and an alarm with no markings is not worthy of being trusted.

I have to say, those Fire Angel alarms I linked to have been the least troublesome alarms I've ever lived with. You re-set them if sounding by pressing the button and for a period after this, they run at reduced sensitivity to avoid a repeat false alarm. The designers have really thought about this and at only £12.50 each, they don't break the bank.

All smoke alarms I have seen mount onto a baseplate. The mains ones I have seen have a socket on the baseplate that the alarm plugs into. If the alarm does not twist off bayonet-style, look for a tab that needs to be pushed in. This may allow the alarm to either twist or hinge down.


Julian F. G. W.

Which reminds me. Good policy is to have a smoke alarm on each floor of the dwelling. And preferably ones with integral lights, for obvious reasons in an emergency. Whenever we use an agent to let our flat, all of this is a firm stipulation, along with the monoxide alarm and the gas and leccy certificates.

BJ

bungeejumper wrote:Which reminds me. Good policy is to have a smoke alarm on each floor of the dwelling. And preferably ones with integral lights, for obvious reasons in an emergency. Whenever we use an agent to let our flat, all of this is a firm stipulation, along with the monoxide alarm and the gas and leccy certificates.

BJ

Point of Order M'Lud,

I'm reasonably sure the carbon monoxide alarm is not mandatory, unless your rental has open fireplaces. Or its in Scotland, where they like to do things differently from England just on principle.

Mike4 wrote:Point of Order M'Lud,

I'm reasonably sure the carbon monoxide alarm is not mandatory, unless your rental has open fireplaces. Or its in Scotland, where they like to do things differently from England just on principle.

It's mandatory from our agent! (Slightly cut-above, slightly higher rent.) And anyway, a fifteen quid CO monitor is good business because it conveys to a tenant that you're a thoughtful landlord. It's also something to tell the insurance company if the unthinkable should ever happen.

BJ

Scotland plans to make interlinked smoke detectors compulsory, even mandating they be retrofitted in all existing homes. Not sure when exactly, it was imminent but they delayed it a bit.

I don't know how they would enforce it.

Scott.

swill453 wrote:Scotland plans to make interlinked smoke detectors compulsory, even mandating they be retrofitted in all existing homes. Not sure when exactly, it was imminent but they delayed it a bit.

It's all here, although this is a commercial site. https://www.safelincs.co.uk/scotland-20 ... de-alarms/ . No idea if these are any good, but as a starting point for comparisons, these systems don't seem too financially crippling.

BJ

bungeejumper wrote:

swill453 wrote:Scotland plans to make interlinked smoke detectors compulsory, even mandating they be retrofitted in all existing homes. Not sure when exactly, it was imminent but they delayed it a bit.

It's all here, although this is a commercial site. https://www.safelincs.co.uk/scotland-20 ... de-alarms/ . No idea if these are any good, but as a starting point for comparisons, these systems don't seem too financially crippling.

I suspect it won't be enforced in any serious way, other than to make it impossible to sell a house that doesn't have them via something in the Home Report.

(I'm talking owner-occupier homes here. Rental properties probably already have enforceable rules on fire detection.)

Scott.

The new Scottish requirements are now to be law in February 2022 unless of course they are postponed again. I have the minimum, that is interlinked smoke alarms in my lobbies/corridors but am told that I need to add a smoke alarm in my main living area and a heat detector in my kitchen, both of which seem to me to be unnecessary. I cannot see that there will be any enforcement unless I try to sell my property or indeed if I have a fire, when the insurers might (I do not know) try to turn down a claim because I was not complying with the law. I assume that this will probably become a specific part of the conditions for insurance if it is not already in a more general sense.

I will be complying with the law once the date is settled, if it is not already.

Dod

Mike4 wrote:What make and model is it?

Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I've just bought two on Amazon to replace the five-year-old Fire Angle ones in my house that have recently started intermittently chirping, and don't have replaceable batts.

Edit to add: P.S. these are what I have, and they have never given me a false alarm even when I've burnt shiite in the kitchen!
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07 ... UTF8&psc=1

Mind you I've never stress-tested
them with real smoke either....

We had Fire Angel smoke alarms that began intermittently chirping after 3 years. On Googling the issue, it became clear this is a common experience. I contacted Fire Angel, who replaced the alarms without demur.

So far, so good.

Watis

Watis wrote:

Mike4 wrote:What make and model is it?

Most smoke alarms have baseplates attached to the wall/ceiling into which the alarm proper is rotated. Yours can prolly be removed by twisting it anticlockwise, but goggle the manual and check.

I've just bought two on Amazon to replace the five-year-old Fire Angle ones in my house that have recently started intermittently chirping, and don't have replaceable batts.

Edit to add: P.S. these are what I have, and they have never given me a false alarm even when I've burnt shiite in the kitchen!
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07 ... UTF8&psc=1

Mind you I've never stress-tested
them with real smoke either....

We had Fire Angel smoke alarms that began intermittently chirping after 3 years. On Googling the issue, it became clear this is a common experience. I contacted Fire Angel, who replaced the alarms without demur.

So far, so good.

Watis

Maybe I should have done this too! Mine starting randomly chirruping (i.e. one chirp about every 12 hours!) when five years old. I initially discounted the fire alarms as the source of the chirp as the label says 10 year sealed battery life, or words to that effect.

But I once the chirp became hourly, I was able to pin it down to one of the alarms and I decided five-year old alarms were getting long in the tooth anyway.