The Lemon Fool

Last year they announced non-payment on 27 September. My reading of the prior announcement was that they would pay, but there could be no certainty of future payments.

No announcement of non-payment and I noticed today that HL are marking MBSP as Ex-dividend. The strange thing is though, when I obtain a sell quote, I am being offered 170 days interest, so not all are agreeing on that Ex-dividend date!

sell quotes for 10k nominal by the way were:
MBSP 97.2 + 170 days interest
MBSR 105.5 + 154 days interest

Pricing ex/cum div still crazy on MBSP. Buy quote: 100.857 MINUS 9 days accrued (0.166p). Sell quote: 97.45 PLUS 174 days accrued (3.209p). Both for 10k nominal. Anyone buying or selling, be doubly sure to check your accrued interest before you commit.

Is there any more clarity on resumed payments yet?

Wizard wrote:Is there any more clarity on resumed payments yet?

When I checked yesterday the quotes were still screwed up on MBSP. The same negative accrued if you wnat to buy, positive if you want to sell. I have little doubt PIBS payments will be made though.

hiriskpaul wrote:

Wizard wrote:Is there any more clarity on resumed payments yet?

When I checked yesterday the quotes were still screwed up on MBSP. The same negative accrued if you wnat to buy, positive if you want to sell. I have little doubt PIBS payments will be made though.

Now its flipped round! BUY 10k quote 101.8 plus 182 days accrued (£335.66), SELL 10k 97.25 minus 1 day accrued (-£1.84).

I received the interest payment today for MSBP into both broker accounts.

Zow1 wrote:I received the interest payment today for MSBP into both broker accounts.

Good news. Pricing has settled down as well. Online quotes show 2 days accrued for both buys and sells, which makes perfect sense.

According to HL, MBSR is Ex-dividend today but showing 169 days accrued on both buys and sells. As with when MBSP went ex-div, the MMs clearly have a different opinion. Trade with care!

I contacted ii this morning to chase up where my MBSR payment has got to. They were pretty unhelpful saying that while they they expected receipt of this last Friday, it hasn't actually in fact arrived and that they wouldn't be chasing it up until it was a week or so late as is their policy. Has anyone actually been paid out for either of the PIBS?

HL haven't paid up yet either. They were slow with MBSP as well though.

hiriskpaul wrote:HL haven't paid up yet either. They were slow with MBSP as well though.

EQI have paid the interest today; other brokers will follow soon I'm sure.

GS

GoSeigen wrote:

hiriskpaul wrote:HL haven't paid up yet either. They were slow with MBSP as well though.

EQI have paid the interest today; other brokers will follow soon I'm sure.

GS

Yep you are right, just received. Maybe with it being the first for a while it needed longer to sort out.

Padders72 wrote:

GoSeigen wrote:

hiriskpaul wrote:HL haven't paid up yet either. They were slow with MBSP as well though.

EQI have paid the interest today; other brokers will follow soon I'm sure.

GS

Yep you are right, just received. Maybe with it being the first for a while it needed longer to sort out.

Payments arrived in our HL accounts this morning.

My attention has been elsewhere for some reason and I have just noticed the results for 2021 were released on 23 Feb:

https://www.themanchester.co.uk/downloa ... s-2021.pdf

Disappointed to see that the Board is still currently considering options for the long-term future of the Society. I was hoping for a bit more than this by now.

Other bits of interest:
- £1m underlying loss. Not great, but could have been worse.
- Further impairment charge of £1.4m (2020: £2.6m) relating to the Society’s Spanish lifetime portfolio, not good news.
- 14.8% reduction in mortgage balances, continuing the balance sheet reduction.
- PIBS are now fully amortised out of CET1 and now classified entirely as Tier 2. Doesn't really matter now due to the win in the SC delivering bucket loads of CET1.
- £9.2m subordinated debt was repaid (£5m at LIBOR+1.75%, £4.2m at LIBOR+2.45%).
- £5m outstanding subordinated debt at 6.70% fixed, due 2032 with option to pay off 5 years earlier.
- About £48m in liquid cash deposits at BoE plus other banks.

The PIBS are all stuck around par value, I assume because the expected trajectory is still eventual winding up and repayment. I see no reason to sell.

hiriskpaul - many thanks for that, really appreciate you noticing the release

Woz

hiriskpaul wrote:I see no reason to sell.

Nor me.
At the current headline prices one could theoretically achieve a substantial yield uplift by trading out of the 6.75s into the 8s.
Assuming of course that one could find sufficient 8s.
Haven't picked up the phone to try it.

V8

88V8 wrote:

hiriskpaul wrote:I see no reason to sell.

Nor me.
At the current headline prices one could theoretically achieve a substantial yield uplift by trading out of the 6.75s into the 8s.
Assuming of course that one could find sufficient 8s.
Haven't picked up the phone to try it.

V8

FWIW, I could only get an online quote to sell 1k nominal of the 6.75% at 97. I got a quote of 105 to buy 7k nominal of the 8%.

Going the other way is easier! Selling the 8%, I was quoted 100 for 20k nominal. Buying the 6.75%, 102 for 20k nominal. Little point in doing that of course.

Prices obtained at Hargreaves Lansdown.

MBSR prices are firming up after their Ukraine war dip, they are going ex soon so buyers will get 4% of their purchase price back in a few weeks. At close to 8% yield these should provide sufficient protection against the current inflation.

WBS are also about to pay their first interest in years, albeit only 0.5%, to long-suffering holders. Their price has risen and I think at c80p they are around fair value at the moment.


GS

GoSeigen wrote:MBSR prices are firming up after their Ukraine war dip, they are going ex soon so buyers will get 4% of their purchase price back in a few weeks. At close to 8% yield these should provide sufficient protection against the current inflation.

WBS are also about to pay their first interest in years, albeit only 0.5%, to long-suffering holders. Their price has risen and I think at c80p they are around fair value at the moment.


GS

FWIW, I cannot get an online buy quote for the 8%, not even 1k nominal. Less of a problem selling, quoted 100.25 for 10k nominal, 100.05 for 50k.

Still no announcement on the future plans for the society. Any thoughts on this? Return to normal lending now a possibility I would have thought, but merger with another BS more likely, or perhaps a takeover by whoever holds the PPDS?

Edit: AGM on 27 April, maybe we will get an announcement or some guidance then.

MBSR payment is late at HL. Has anyone been paid yet?