Donate to Remove ads

Got a credit card? use our Credit Card & Finance Calculators

Thanks to Bhoddhisatva,scotia,Anonymous,Cornytiv34,Anonymous, for Donating to support the site

PIBS at HL

Gilts, bonds, and interest-bearing shares
hiriskpaul
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 3827
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:04 pm
Has thanked: 673 times
Been thanked: 1467 times

PIBS at HL

#402696

Postby hiriskpaul » April 8th, 2021, 6:31 pm

Received today:

Changes to our service removal of purchases in certificated Permanent Interest Bearing Shares PIBS

Dear Mr Hiriskpaul

Our clients’ investment into PIBS which cannot be held electronically has decreased significantly and as a result only a very small number buy these types of investments through us now. We’ve therefore made the decision to no longer offer new buys into PIBS we cannot hold electronically. You can continue to hold any PIBS you have which aren’t held electronically with us and sell them at any time, you just can’t buy anymore.

We have a number of PIBS which can be held electronically available through our website, more information on these can be found here.

We know this will be a disappointing message for some of our clients to read and we are sorry for any inconvenience it may cause. If you need help with trading online or over the telephone or would like to find out more about what other services HL offer, please visit our website or get in touch.

Yours sincerely,
HL


I am not sure which PIBS they are referring to, or even if I hold any, but I have asked. At least they are not forcing disposal.

Gan020
Lemon Slice
Posts: 461
Joined: March 3rd, 2019, 12:25 pm
Has thanked: 178 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#402847

Postby Gan020 » April 9th, 2021, 10:56 am

I have one PIBS holding with HL and have not received the email so I intepret that you must have at least one holding which is in certificated form.

I would appreciate an update when you have one. It's a sad day when brokers keep removing instruments. I understand and appreciate they have extra costs involved in dealing outside of CREST but since anything outside of CREST would be phone dealing for which they get £50 rather than the usual £11.95 I would have thought that would have covered it.

88V8
Lemon Half
Posts: 5743
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:22 am
Has thanked: 4068 times
Been thanked: 2553 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#403358

Postby 88V8 » April 11th, 2021, 10:05 am

There has also been a reduction in ii's willingness to trade oddities online, but at least they maintain a phone option, and provided one is buying in reasonable size the cost is not bothersome.

Presumably Canaccord still maintain a full service. Not a client, but for FI, I keep them in mind.

V8

hiriskpaul
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 3827
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:04 pm
Has thanked: 673 times
Been thanked: 1467 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#403371

Postby hiriskpaul » April 11th, 2021, 11:06 am

Did not get a very helpful reply from HL, but I clicked on a trade button for the PIBS I hold to work out which ones can no longer be purchased.

Cannot be purchased any longer:
Leeds Building Society (LBS) 13.375%
Skipton Building Society (SKIP) 12.875%
Coventry Building Society (CVBP) 12 1/8%

Still OK:
Bank Of Ireland (BOI) 13 3/8% Uns Perp Sub Bds
Manchester Building Society (MBSR) 8%
Newcastle Building Society (NBSR) 12.625%
Nottingham Building Society (NOTP) 7.875%

88V8
Lemon Half
Posts: 5743
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:22 am
Has thanked: 4068 times
Been thanked: 2553 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#403810

Postby 88V8 » April 13th, 2021, 10:04 am

hiriskpaul wrote:... to work out which ones can no longer be purchased.

At ii, I see today one cannot buy any of the above online.
Hopefully by phone.
The universe is shrinking.

V8

Holts
2 Lemon pips
Posts: 123
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 8:28 pm
Has thanked: 3 times
Been thanked: 9 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#403847

Postby Holts » April 13th, 2021, 12:10 pm

The universe is shrinking.

V8


yes , all part of the service we were assured about all those years ago , add in selftrade shunting their customers off to ii as another example.

hiriskpaul
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 3827
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:04 pm
Has thanked: 673 times
Been thanked: 1467 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#403974

Postby hiriskpaul » April 13th, 2021, 5:37 pm

88V8 wrote:
hiriskpaul wrote:... to work out which ones can no longer be purchased.

At ii, I see today one cannot buy any of the above online.
Hopefully by phone.
The universe is shrinking.

V8

No, cannot buy over the phone either. Bit of a pain if the access reverts to full service brokers only as PIBS are best put in SIPPs and ISAs.

88V8
Lemon Half
Posts: 5743
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 11:22 am
Has thanked: 4068 times
Been thanked: 2553 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#404116

Postby 88V8 » April 14th, 2021, 10:21 am

hiriskpaul wrote:... PIBS are best put in SIPPs and ISAs.

Yes, and I'm looking today to re-stuff my ISA.

Do recall a few years ago on TMF, building socs being regarded as a bad idea. We got out back then, with the exception of some NBSR and SKIP. Now it seems a good idea to get back in again.

However, we don't withdraw any income from our ISA. It just rolls up. So TR matters. Unlike my tax-exposed account, where it's all about the yield.
The SPs of all the above are pretty much back to their two-year highs, along with most FI. Soooo, TR-wise that's a hmmm.

And they're Financials. Having offloaded most of our Prefs, I have headroom in Financials, but do I really want to get back in, now, at these prices?

Must admit I'm leaning more towards income ITs. In recent months I've loaded up our tax-exposed accounts with Shires SHRS as a bond proxy. Yield today is only 5%, so I'm dropping a percentage point but I don't have to make the decisions and worry about what I can and can't buy, and if one takes account of the HRT differential between income and dividend, the percentage point shrinks.

Although it would feel defeatist to begin stuffing the ISA with ITs.
Back to dithering.

V8

Gan020
Lemon Slice
Posts: 461
Joined: March 3rd, 2019, 12:25 pm
Has thanked: 178 times
Been thanked: 246 times

Re: PIBS at HL

#404417

Postby Gan020 » April 15th, 2021, 9:50 am

Regrettably I came to the decision about 2 years ago that the high yield IT's have access to so many instruments that we do not, due to the 100k minimum trade size, which is now becoming 200k, that I had no choice but to start buying them.

It was something I really didn't want to do as I much prefer to buy bonds direct in the knowledge that the price may go up or down but eventually they will mature at par and I therefore know what yield I'm getting. With high yield IT's I'm carrying far more risk of capital gains or losses and I think more likely losses as I perceive interest rates will go up faster than the market predicts.

It has however, worked out well so far, although I'm now looking at the prices and wouldn't want to be buying here. Others clearly are though and I'm now looking to slice perhaps 10% of my holdings as they look a little toppy to me. Of course in this market toppy means nothing and they could be even more toppy next month.

My issue is the same as it ever is though. If I sell I'm really got nothing on my list I want to buy other than what I've got already and I can't buy any more of what I've got already as I've got enough.


Which brings me back on topic, which is that the universe keeps shrinking and there is nothing I can personally do about it. All very frustrating.


Return to “Gilts and Bonds”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests