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Law Debenture ( LWDB)

Closed-end funds and OEICs
Darka
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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#434158

Postby Darka » August 11th, 2021, 6:52 pm

ReallyVeryFoolish wrote:Very happy to see LWDB closed at 800p today. Bought into this IT as part of a portfolio reshaping last year, around 500p from memory. I locked in a generous yield and the significant share price appreciation has been most welcome if somewhat unexpected by me.

RVF


Me too, got in at £5.20.

Only regret is not being able to buy more at the time.

Itsallaguess
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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#434164

Postby Itsallaguess » August 11th, 2021, 7:18 pm

ReallyVeryFoolish wrote:
Very happy to see LWDB closed at 800p today.

Bought into this IT as part of a portfolio reshaping last year, around 500p from memory.

I locked in a generous yield and the significant share price appreciation has been most welcome if somewhat unexpected by me.


LWDB has done well over the years - I've been nibbling away with a few buys since a first tranche in 2014, and following my last purchase in June of last year, I can see an average buy price of around £5.49 according to my broker, with a 46% overall gain in capital from my various purchases.

As can be seen below, it's yield has been relatively steady over the years, hovering around the 3% mark, but with good share-price appreciation over recent years, that of course means that the dividend-growth itself has been quite good over the same period, and especially so recently -

Image

Sources -

https://www.dividenddata.co.uk/dividend-yield.py?epic=LWDB

https://www.google.com/finance/quote/LWDB:LON?window=MAX

https://www.dividenddata.co.uk/dividend-history.py?epic=LWDB

As a slightly lower-yielding component of my diversified income-portfolio (4.5% income weighting and 5.2% capital weighting), it's sitting in a fairly good sweet-spot of steadily rising dividends and good capital appreciation, so no complaints at all from me either..

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436029

Postby MDS1951 » August 19th, 2021, 5:54 pm

I bought my shares in Law Debenture in four tranches between April and July 2016 at an average price of 486.7p. Since then the capital value of the shares compared with what I paid for them has increased by 63.3%. Its share of the total dividend income from my ten ITs has increased from 8.35% to 12.31%. Overall it's the star performer in my small IT portfolio.

I wish I had bought more of them, but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

MDS1951

monabri
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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436049

Postby monabri » August 19th, 2021, 6:47 pm

My fortunate timing of buying into LWDB is not quite balanced by the unfortunate timing of buying into HSBA. Some you win.......

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436053

Postby TUK020 » August 19th, 2021, 7:09 pm

MDS1951 wrote:I bought my shares in Law Debenture in four tranches between April and July 2016 at an average price of 486.7p. Since then the capital value of the shares compared with what I paid for them has increased by 63.3%. Its share of the total dividend income from my ten ITs has increased from 8.35% to 12.31%. Overall it's the star performer in my small IT portfolio.

I wish I had bought more of them, but hindsight is a wonderful thing.

MDS1951

more relevant question: would you top them up?

MDS1951
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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436068

Postby MDS1951 » August 19th, 2021, 8:32 pm

TUK020 wrote:-

more relevant question: would you top them up?


Yes. Whenever the opportunity arises I'm moving my HYP-ish portfolio away from individual shares and into collective investments because I'm fed up picking individual shares. I can't recall how the opportunity arose, but in that HYP on 18 January 2021 I bought 246 LWDB shares at a cost of 670.34p a share. Last month I received my return of capital from Pennon Group re the disposal of Viridor and on 19 July I used that to buy a further 218 shares in LWDB at a cost of 744.69p a share. They are a little below the value of my median holding in that portfolio, so I might buy some more if a further opportunity arises.

Time will tell whether I have made the right call.

MDS1951

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436163

Postby dundas666 » August 20th, 2021, 9:21 am

I bought LWDB in January when the yield was 4.2% and topped up earlier this month when share price rise meant the yield had dropped to 3.5%.

I'd like to continue topping up further over time but not if the purchase yield falls below 3.5% I think.

Overall I'm happy to hold long term and hope the dividends continue to grow by 5% pa.

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436193

Postby richfool » August 20th, 2021, 11:10 am

I hold some LWDB, but have never gone overboard on it as I don't like its holdings of banks, "oil gas and basic materials" and GSK in its top ten holdings.

Can anyone reassure me that I should increase my holdings of banks and oilies, which I would be doing if I were to top up LWDB? (I also hold enough miners elsewhere).

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436232

Postby jonesa1 » August 20th, 2021, 1:24 pm

My doubts about LWDB as a long-term investment are:
- its portfolio is managed by the same duo that manage Lowland, which has been a very poor performer for many years
- the out-performance of LWDB seems to be largely from the included services business, so (like LTI) it's an investment that is heavily dependent on the performance of a single business.

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436252

Postby dundas666 » August 20th, 2021, 2:43 pm

According to the AIC data LWDB is 4th out of 25 UK Equity Income ITs for 10 year total return (236.22% = 12.9% pa), 1st over 5 years and 2nd in 3 year TR, so amongst it's peers that compares pretty well.

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436276

Postby Arborbridge » August 20th, 2021, 3:51 pm

jonesa1 wrote:My doubts about LWDB as a long-term investment are:
- its portfolio is managed by the same duo that manage Lowland, which has been a very poor performer for many years
- the out-performance of LWDB seems to be largely from the included services business, so (like LTI) it's an investment that is heavily dependent on the performance of a single business.


That has always worried me too, but since this IT always seems to come up with the goods (and that's since I first bought in 1980's I think, I have never sought to sell it.

Arb.

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436279

Postby richfool » August 20th, 2021, 3:58 pm

dundas666 wrote:According to the AIC data LWDB is 4th out of 25 UK Equity Income ITs for 10 year total return (236.22% = 12.9% pa), 1st over 5 years and 2nd in 3 year TR, so amongst it's peers that compares pretty well.

Yes, I can't really fault its capital performance. It's just that I don't like or believe in its holdings of Oilies like BP and Shell and UK banks, or anything particularly cyclical (in a UK G&I trust). (And I also missed out on the time when it was yielding something like 6%, so can't justify compromising my principles because of its high yield! ;) )

In the UK G&I space my largest holding is DIG.

Arborbridge
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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#436314

Postby Arborbridge » August 20th, 2021, 5:25 pm

richfool wrote:
dundas666 wrote:According to the AIC data LWDB is 4th out of 25 UK Equity Income ITs for 10 year total return (236.22% = 12.9% pa), 1st over 5 years and 2nd in 3 year TR, so amongst it's peers that compares pretty well.

Yes, I can't really fault its capital performance. It's just that I don't like or believe in its holdings of Oilies like BP and Shell and UK banks, or anything particularly cyclical (in a UK G&I trust). (And I also missed out on the time when it was yielding something like 6%, so can't justify compromising my principles because of its high yield! ;) )

In the UK G&I space my largest holding is DIG.


Was it ever yielding tht much? Gosh, I missed it too. The only times I have ever topped up were Feb 2016 and July 2020 - because it never yielded enough before. I'm not sure what the yield was on those occasions, but only rouns 3-4% I would guess.

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#446653

Postby richfool » September 30th, 2021, 4:04 pm

The Law Debenture Corporation p.l.c.

Second Interim Dividend Announcement - Board increases dividend by 5.8%

· Declaring a second interim dividend of 6.875 pence per ordinary share payable in October 2021, representing an increase of 5.8% over the prior year's second interim dividend.


· It remains the Board's intention for each of the first three interim dividends for 2021 to be equivalent to a quarter of Law Debenture's total 2020 dividend of 27.5 pence per ordinary share.

· The Board's current intention is for the total 2021 dividend to be an increase on the total 2020 dividend of 27.5 pence per ordinary share.


The pandemic has had a residual effect on dividends across the market that will likely affect dividend payments for the next several years. Despite this, Law Debenture will enter its 43rd year of maintaining or increasing its dividend payments. The combination of Law Debenture's Independent Professional Services businesses, which offers a reliable stream of revenue, and strong reserves continues to give the Board confidence.

In line with our investment objective of achieving long-term capital growth and steadily increasing income for shareholders, we have declared a second interim dividend of 6.875 pence per ordinary share.

This dividend will be paid on 28 October 2021 to shareholders on the register at close of business on 8 October 2021. The Corporation's shares will go ex-dividend on 7 October 2021.

https://www.investegate.co.uk/law-deben ... 16126064N/

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#446655

Postby 88V8 » September 30th, 2021, 4:09 pm

But the yield's only 3.7%. Although the divi growth is good.
Trying to convince myself to top up as I have sale proceeds & divis to reinvest.
It seems a bit of a Diageo.....

V8

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#446659

Postby Dod101 » September 30th, 2021, 4:17 pm

88V8 wrote:But the yield's only 3.7%. Although the divi growth is good.
Trying to convince myself to top up as I have sale proceeds & divis to reinvest.
It seems a bit of a Diageo.....

V8


And what is wrong with that? Wish all my share's were like Diageo.

Dod

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#446686

Postby Itsallaguess » September 30th, 2021, 5:26 pm

Some figures from the AIC -

Image

Source - https://www.theaic.co.uk/investment-company-screener#?filtersSelectedValue=%7B%22term%22:%22lwdb%22%7D

LWDB has been a solid overall performer in my income-portfolio for many years...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#446997

Postby Arborbridge » October 1st, 2021, 3:27 pm

If LWDB is yielding 3.7%, that must nearly as good as it gets in "normal" times. I last topped up in July 2020 when I was a bit lucky to get just under 5%, but that was when the sweet shop was opened only briefly. The last time was in 2016.

I have an off-on relationship with LWDB which is one of my oldest holdings along with CTY. I just have a queezy feeling because a large lart of its revenue is from its own business as an add on, so it is far from a conventional IT investment. On the other hand, it seems to work OK.

Arb.

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Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#466454

Postby monabri » December 16th, 2021, 5:28 pm

https://www.investegate.co.uk/law-deben ... 25199453V/

In line with our investment objective of achieving long-term capital growth and steadily increasing income for shareholders, we have declared a third interim dividend of 6.875 pence per ordinary share, representing a 5.8% increase over the prior year's third interim dividend.

This dividend will be paid on 28 January 2022 to shareholders on the register at close of business on 24 December 2021. The Corporation's shares will go ex-dividend on 23 December 2021. "

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Re: Law Debenture ( LWDB)

#467030

Postby 88V8 » December 18th, 2021, 12:52 pm

monabri wrote:...representing a 5.8% increase over the prior year's third interim dividend.

We're going to need some of these nice increases. Shame the yield is currently so low, but happy to have got in when it wasn't.

Other ITs with long records maintained by running down reserves and consequently offering minimal increases, look less attractive now.

V8


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