The Lemon Fool

https://citywire.com/investment-trust-i ... der+Weekly

"The board of Smithson (SSON) investment trust has bowed to shareholder pressure and reversed its decision to not hold a continuation vote.
In annual results last week, the board said it would not propose a continuation vote at the annual general meeting, despite the shares breaching the trigger point of a double-digit discount in 2023."

"A continuation vote always carries risks for an investment company, but the response of investors and analysts suggests Smithson will survive the ballot."

If Smithson goes the way of FEET then is the Smith empire/fetish formally over?

That its survival is even being debated is not a good sign.

It's been dreadful. I'm minded to vote against the board and against continuation. I don't see any threat to the Fundsmith LLP business. Smithson is nothing but a minor distraction to the business, IMO.

What would be the situation for shareholders if they vote to wind up? Wouldn't the assets be likely to achieve less than the current estimated value, and there would be some horrendous winding up fees to pay.
Unless the assets are subsumed into another IT, but it's unlikely that Smith would want to buy these assets in oune of his other funds, I'm guessing.

Big shareholders might be losing patience, but they are unlikely to want to lose even more by selling.
Interestingly, for many private investors, a 13% discount would be a tempting buy - one I normally look back on and think "why didn't I have the courage?"!


Arb.

Arborbridge wrote:What would be the situation for shareholders if they vote to wind up? Wouldn't the assets be likely to achieve less than the current estimated value, and there would be some horrendous winding up fees to pay.
Unless the assets are subsumed into another IT, but it's unlikely that Smith would want to buy these assets in oune of his other funds, I'm guessing.

Big shareholders might be losing patience, but they are unlikely to want to lose even more by selling.
Interestingly, for many private investors, a 13% discount would be a tempting buy - one I normally look back on and think "why didn't I have the courage?"!


Arb.

Winding up seems to have worked just fine for FEET? And that's quite recent.

BullDog wrote:

Arborbridge wrote:What would be the situation for shareholders if they vote to wind up? Wouldn't the assets be likely to achieve less than the current estimated value, and there would be some horrendous winding up fees to pay.
Unless the assets are subsumed into another IT, but it's unlikely that Smith would want to buy these assets in oune of his other funds, I'm guessing.

Big shareholders might be losing patience, but they are unlikely to want to lose even more by selling.
Interestingly, for many private investors, a 13% discount would be a tempting buy - one I normally look back on and think "why didn't I have the courage?"!


Arb.

Winding up seems to have worked just fine for FEET? And that's quite recent.

I wasn't in touch with that one. Did it achieve NAV or near NAV for the shareholders?

Arborbridge wrote:

BullDog wrote:Winding up seems to have worked just fine for FEET? And that's quite recent.

I wasn't in touch with that one. Did it achieve NAV or near NAV for the shareholders?

Likely other members here are better placed to answer that as I wasn't a FEET shareholder. Hopefully they'll answer your question.

I'm in SSON since IPO and the first few years were stellar. But recently it's been dreadful and the volatility has been shocking for a portfolio of supposedly high quality share holdings. I expect the vote to continue the trust but I have already voted against the board and against continuation.

BullDog wrote:

Arborbridge wrote:
I wasn't in touch with that one. Did it achieve NAV or near NAV for the shareholders?

Likely other members here are better placed to answer that as I wasn't a FEET shareholder. Hopefully they'll answer your question.

I'm in SSON since IPO and the first few years were stellar. But recently it's been dreadful and the volatility has been shocking for a portfolio of supposedly high quality share holdings. I expect the vote to continue the trust but I have already voted against the board and against continuation.

I had a quick look at the FEET thread on here for the first time - it's very long now, but I can't as yet find any particular post which tells me what the position is for ordinary holders. Perhaps it isn't fully resolved yet. Unfortunately, the link I found to some possibly relevant news was "page not found".

Hopefully. someone will fill me in on what happened. I have a family interest in SSON as my daughter bought some a few years back.

Arb

Arborbridge wrote:

BullDog wrote:Likely other members here are better placed to answer that as I wasn't a FEET shareholder. Hopefully they'll answer your question.

I'm in SSON since IPO and the first few years were stellar. But recently it's been dreadful and the volatility has been shocking for a portfolio of supposedly high quality share holdings. I expect the vote to continue the trust but I have already voted against the board and against continuation.

I had a quick look at the FEET thread on here for the first time - it's very long now, but I can't as yet find any particular post which tells me what the position is for ordinary holders. Perhaps it isn't fully resolved yet. Unfortunately, the link I found to some possibly relevant news was "page not found".

Hopefully. someone will fill me in on what happened. I have a family interest in SSON as my daughter bought some a few years back.

Arb

Sorry about that. I've got the point where I could do with that money generating an income stream. So I have run out of time now with SSON. A shame, because if the continuation vote is passed and I then sell, the BullDog trading rule says that the shares will immediately rise significantly. Such is life

BullDog wrote:
Sorry about that. I've got the point where I could do with that money generating an income stream. So I have run out of time now with SSON. A shame, because if the continuation vote is passed and I then sell, the BullDog trading rule says that the shares will immediately rise significantly. Such is life

I've gone beyond SSON type ITs myself. I like investments which contribute at least a little to my income streams.

However, my daughter is at an earlier stage.

Arb.

Arborbridge wrote:

BullDog wrote:
Sorry about that. I've got the point where I could do with that money generating an income stream. So I have run out of time now with SSON. A shame, because if the continuation vote is passed and I then sell, the BullDog trading rule says that the shares will immediately rise significantly. Such is life

I've gone beyond SSON type ITs myself. I like investments which contribute at least a little to my income streams.

However, my daughter is at an earlier stage.

Arb.

Yes, SSON is now my only non income generating holding. I have been waiting for the share price to turn round. But I've lost patience. I'll decide finally what to do after the vote. 99% likely I'll sell if the trust continues.

Arborbridge wrote:

BullDog wrote:Sorry about that. I've got the point where I could do with that money generating an income stream. So I have run out of time now with SSON. A shame, because if the continuation vote is passed and I then sell, the BullDog trading rule says that the shares will immediately rise significantly. Such is life

I've gone beyond SSON type ITs myself. I like investments which contribute at least a little to my income streams.

However, my daughter is at an earlier stage.

There is something to be said for securities that pay no income, if held in a taxable account. There are no tax events until you sell, and nothing to report on your tax return.

This applies to a few "growthy" ITs as well as various US shares such as Berkshire Hathaway, Google and Amazon. Basically your "income" rolls up tax-free within your holdings.

All that said SSON has been disappointing and I will chop it next month. I retain Fundsmith which does pay a dividend, but only a small one.

Lootman wrote:

Arborbridge wrote:I've gone beyond SSON type ITs myself. I like investments which contribute at least a little to my income streams.

However, my daughter is at an earlier stage.

There is something to be said for securities that pay no income, if held in a taxable account. There are no tax events until you sell, and nothing to report on your tax return.

This applies to a few "growthy" ITs as well as various US shares such as Berkshire Hathaway, Google and Amazon. Basically your "income" rolls up tax-free within your holdings.

All that said SSON has been disappointing and I will chop it next month. I retain Fundsmith which does pay a dividend, but only a small one.

You intend voting to wind Smithson up in the continuation vote?

BullDog wrote:

Lootman wrote:There is something to be said for securities that pay no income, if held in a taxable account. There are no tax events until you sell, and nothing to report on your tax return.

This applies to a few "growthy" ITs as well as various US shares such as Berkshire Hathaway, Google and Amazon. Basically your "income" rolls up tax-free within your holdings.

All that said SSON has been disappointing and I will chop it next month. I retain Fundsmith which does pay a dividend, but only a small one.

You intend voting to wind Smithson up in the continuation vote?

I don't usually vote on my holdings. And since I have been annoyed with the slow payout on FEET, I will sell in the market. But a vote to wind-up might narrow the discount and that would please.

Arborbridge wrote:

BullDog wrote:Likely other members here are better placed to answer that as I wasn't a FEET shareholder. Hopefully they'll answer your question.

I'm in SSON since IPO and the first few years were stellar. But recently it's been dreadful and the volatility has been shocking for a portfolio of supposedly high quality share holdings. I expect the vote to continue the trust but I have already voted against the board and against continuation.

I had a quick look at the FEET thread on here for the first time - it's very long now, but I can't as yet find any particular post which tells me what the position is for ordinary holders. Perhaps it isn't fully resolved yet. Unfortunately, the link I found to some possibly relevant news was "page not found".

Hopefully. someone will fill me in on what happened. I have a family interest in SSON as my daughter bought some a few years back.

Arb

FEET liquidation details at https://www.feetplc.co.uk/

scotia wrote:

Arborbridge wrote:
I had a quick look at the FEET thread on here for the first time - it's very long now, but I can't as yet find any particular post which tells me what the position is for ordinary holders. Perhaps it isn't fully resolved yet. Unfortunately, the link I found to some possibly relevant news was "page not found".

Hopefully. someone will fill me in on what happened. I have a family interest in SSON as my daughter bought some a few years back.

Arb

FEET liquidation details at https://www.feetplc.co.uk/

Thank you scotia - that's just what I needed.

Arb.