Range info please: VW id3 58kw version

[Arborbridge]

I had an hour or so test drive in one of these yesterday, and was very impressed. Complaints I have read about the minimalist interior with touch screen controls with few knobs were confounded: this factor did not seem to bother me. The things you do need fairly immediately are quickly available or do have push buttons controls on or around the steering wheel. The driving display is commendably clear and concise telling me the most important things I need to know.

So far, so good. After having also tried the Kia e-Niro (which as a Star Trek fan, I keep wanting to call a "Kyra")
which is also very attractive, though I didn't find its driving position suited me as well, and has a bigger range.

But, here's the rub: the range of the ID3 is less and 262 miles. Now, this wouldn't be so bad, but I have read at least one test in which the real range for a mixture of driving (50% at 70mph) is only 226 miles, and that on a mild day, not winter with the lights or wipers on. If so, this car will require a top up on my current longest range journey to Devon, which is a complication one could do without.

So, this is just an appeal to anyone who drives an ID3 to come forward with some idea of their own real world experience of what range can be achieved on long journeys, mostly on motorways or major roads such as the A303.

Arb.

[monabri]

Couple of reviews on YouTube.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2hn31vLKgho

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4dOEsSVEawc

( interesting size comparison with the original Golf!)

[monabri]

In the last review he broke it! That screen driven menu system looks to be very distracting...and then it breaks!

( white plastic ...that will not wear well!)

[monabri]

I had an hour or so test drive in one of these yesterday, and was very impressed. Complaints I have read about the minimalist interior with touch screen controls with few knobs were confounded: this factor did not seem to bother me. The things you do need fairly immediately are quickly available or do have push buttons controls on or around the steering wheel. The driving display is commendably clear and concise telling me the most important things I need to know.

So far, so good. After having also tried the Kia e-Niro (which as a Star Trek fan, I keep wanting to call a "Kyra")
which is also very attractive, though I didn't find its driving position suited me as well, and has a bigger range.

But, here's the rub: the range of the ID3 is less and 262 miles. Now, this wouldn't be so bad, but I have read at least one test in which the real range for a mixture of driving (50% at 70mph) is only 226 miles, and that on a mild day, not winter with the lights or wipers on. If so, this car will require a top up on my current longest range journey to Devon, which is a complication one could do without.

So, this is just an appeal to anyone who drives an ID3 to come forward with some idea of their own real world experience of what range can be achieved on long journeys, mostly on motorways or major roads such as the A303.

Arb.

Based on the 2 videos ... you will need to recharge.

[AF62]

the range of the ID3 is less and 262 miles.

That is the WLTP range and is a fantasy, the same as the manufacturer quoted MPG figures for ICE cars are nonsense, and you will never ever get even close to that over the course of a year.

The EV Database is a good place to look for some 'real world' figures rather than the nonsense* promoted by car manufacturers. https://ev-database.uk/car/1531/Volkswagen-ID3-Pro

For the 58kWh Pro model that gives a more realistic 215 mile range, and it also gives energy consumption figures in various situations (city, highway, winter, summer).

A winter (-10c) journey at A road / motorway speeds is going to be using 370wh/mile so with a 58kWh battery, if fully charged that would get you just over 150 miles, although with the UK normally being milder than that, you might get as far as 180 miles.

*nonsense because the WLTP rating requires the car to be 'heat soaked' at 23c (when is the UK 23c for any length of time) and driven like a nun on her way to church with a basket of eggs on the passenger seat.

[scrumpyjack]

I have an ID4, which is probably very similar to the ID3. A few comments about range. Nominally the ID4 has a range of 310 miles but you need to take into account a number of factors:

It is recommended that you only charge to 80% normally (100% is OK for the occasional longer journey) and of course you would not want to let it get to 0% before finding a charger!

The real max range is a lot lower than 310 if you have climate control on, if the weather is cold and if you travel at high speed. At 70 motorway cruising you get a lot less.

So having charged my car last night to 80%, it tells me this morning that it has 192 miles left (it's cold so it takes account of that).

However topping up at a charger is no big deal, just remember you want at least a 50kw charger to avoid stopping for long.
I have have my car for 8 months and have only had to charge away from home once, on a trip around North Norfolk. There 20 minutes at the Fakenham Tesco on a 50kw charger was enough and added 70 miles range.

[bungeejumper]

Oh god, all that white plastic. I'd be car-sick before I'd even gone anywhere.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4dOEsSVEawc

I particularly liked the bit about six minutes in, where he charges his 260 mile range car to the max and it tells him he's got 200 miles of range. (Which might be correct, actually, because that's the quoted range for UK highways.) And then he puts the car into reverse, and straight away it says 179 miles!

Either the defeat device (remember that?) is designed to work only in forward gear, or else the car is trying to guesstimate the range while driving in reverse all the way to London and back.

Hmmm, for some reason, I suspect that the proud "1st edition" flash on the front wing might turn out to be a bit of a drag on its future resale value? But then, who buys the first buggy edition of a new model anyway?

BJ

[AF62]

It is recommended that you only charge to 80% normally (100% is OK for the occasional longer journey)

A bit of an urban myth dating back to the first EVs as modern EVs and their batteries are far better at managing charging, and the only two reasons you might want to avoid charging above 80% is it takes a lot longer to fill that last 20% and regeneration mode doesn’t work with a full battery as there is nowhere to put the regenerated energy.

What can mess with a battery is very frequent use of ultra rapid chargers - not occasional, but daily empty to full chargers with an ultra rapid.

[scrumpyjack]

It is recommended that you only charge to 80% normally (100% is OK for the occasional longer journey)

A bit of an urban myth dating back to the first EVs as modern EVs and their batteries are far better at managing charging, and the only two reasons you might want to avoid charging above 80% is it takes a lot longer to fill that last 20% and regeneration mode doesn’t work with a full battery as there is nowhere to put the regenerated energy.

What can mess with a battery is very frequent use of ultra rapid chargers - not occasional, but daily empty to full chargers with an ultra rapid.

Well it is what VW have told me and what their vehicle charging screen says so I guess they know what they are doing.

[BobbyD]

May or may not be a solution but there are ID.3 trims that come with the bigger 77kWh battery pack and have WLTP ranges north of of 300 miles.

[AF62]

Well it is what VW have told me and what their vehicle charging screen says so I guess they know what they are doing.

That would be the VW who told all their diesel car customers that their cars were nice and environmentally friendly…

[scrumpyjack]

Well it is what VW have told me and what their vehicle charging screen says so I guess they know what they are doing.

That would be the VW who told all their diesel car customers that their cars were nice and environmentally friendly…

That's right. I'm suing them over that (via Leigh Day)

[monabri]

Is it a case that the 77kWh variant should theoretically have a 32% greater range than the 58kWh? So, we'd be looking at a realistic range of 180miles x 1.32 = 238 miles. How much extra £££ is the bigger battery model?

( £39k ? and still would give you range anxiety! )

[scotview]

We have the 45kWh ID.3.

In August it was showing 207 miles at 100% charge and we were generally getting that range.

Now, in the colder months, I recon we are getting about 170 miles for a 100% charge, with heating and lights on. Also poorer battery performance in the cold. We mainly home charge and use it for local journeys. My wife absolutely loves it but she has mentioned range limit on a few occasions.

The funny thing is, this car was the basic model with lowest cost. To go to 70 kWh battery would increase the cost hugely, without a pro rata increase in battery range. The ID.3 is no longer offered with the 45kW battery.

Some Chinese BEVs are offering great value for money. The latest MG ZS EV offers a 70kWh battery for around £30K.

I think all BEVs would lose significant range in winter months.

[Arborbridge]

May or may not be a solution but there are ID.3 trims that come with the bigger 77kWh battery pack and have WLTP ranges north of of 300 miles.

I enquired about that, but they do not come as an optional extra, except by buying the higher trimmed car - the "Tour" version - which starts at £39,685.

Kia at least give you the option of just paying for different battery sizes. I'm sure years ago, it was the practice to be able to pay for extra features: now they've tied one down to different trim levels which may also include items in which one is not interested.

Truth is, though, that I found the Kia seating position less comfortable.

[Arborbridge]

Oh god, all that white plastic. I'd be car-sick before I'd even gone anywhere.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4dOEsSVEawc

I particularly liked the bit about six minutes in, where he charges his 260 mile range car to the max and it tells him he's got 200 miles of range. (Which might be correct, actually, because that's the quoted range for UK highways.) And then he puts the car into reverse, and straight away it says 179 miles!

Either the defeat device (remember that?) is designed to work only in forward gear, or else the car is trying to guesstimate the range while driving in reverse all the way to London and back.

Hmmm, for some reason, I suspect that the proud "1st edition" flash on the front wing might turn out to be a bit of a drag on its future resale value? But then, who buys the first buggy edition of a new model anyway?

BJ

Well, the one I tried, there wasn't a hint of white plastic! And fortunately, it wouldn't be a first edition.

More worrying was the software glitches. Almost everything on this car runs by software, and this glitchyness would be serious if they infiltrated the main systems rther than just those things one can do without and never really needed. I doubt one could ever really find out whether the software had been fixed properly without buying one - and a question would be whether software updates would be part of the deal.
As one reviewer said, heaven forbid that cars become like mobile phones where "software support" ends after four years.

Arb.

[Arborbridge]

Interesting to watch the various reviews, and to see what people get annoyed about. For example, one criticism of the ID3 is that there are not many buttons and it's all a bit of a fiddle with the touch screen and sliders etc. And two guys managed to find sharp edges which may have been cured, as we noticed nothing.

I can tell you, neither my wife or I had any problems. You can just jump in the car and it is simple to drive - The various essential controls are easy to find and intuitive, and the displays have a logical layout and easy to see. In that respect, Mrs Arb found it actually easier than the Niro whch has buttons everywhere and confusingly detailed displays.

The thing I would say - and which will take getting used to - is the car wants to take control and has a little nanny personality. However, I believe this is just a question of adapting to it or modifying settings, much as one would with any modern device.


Arb.

[9873210]

Well, the one I tried, there wasn't a hint of white plastic! And fortunately, it wouldn't be a first edition.

More worrying was the software glitches. Almost everything on this car runs by software, and this glitchyness would be serious if they infiltrated the main systems rther than just those things one can do without and never really needed. I doubt one could ever really find out whether the software had been fixed properly without buying one - and a question would be whether software updates would be part of the deal.
As one reviewer said, heaven forbid that cars become like mobile phones where "software support" ends after four years.

Arb.

That ship has sailed. Every modern vehicle (ICE, hybrid, BEV, solar or RTG) is almost entirely run by software. There's nothing special about BEVs in this regard.

[Urbandreamer]

Well, the one I tried, there wasn't a hint of white plastic! And fortunately, it wouldn't be a first edition.

More worrying was the software glitches. Almost everything on this car runs by software, and this glitchyness would be serious if they infiltrated the main systems rther than just those things one can do without and never really needed. I doubt one could ever really find out whether the software had been fixed properly without buying one - and a question would be whether software updates would be part of the deal.
As one reviewer said, heaven forbid that cars become like mobile phones where "software support" ends after four years.

Arb.

That ship has sailed. Every modern vehicle (ICE, hybrid, BEV, solar or RTG) is almost entirely run by software. There's nothing special about BEVs in this regard.

Indeed. I should however point out that software itself is often not the issue. The issue is design philosophy. Less means less to go wrong. More bells and whistles and you get a car that you can't unlock or start, because you forgot to charge your mobile phone or the app broke. The same manufacturer also used the auxiliary battery to unlock the "frunk" so that you can change or CHARGE a dead aux battery. You are stuffed if you let it die. Sure it's a BEV, but you could choose to make the same mistakes on a petrol car.

Meanwhile I watched a great review of Europe's cheapest BEV. Not a bell or whistle in sight. The reviewer loved it for what it is. It's useless for Arb though. Limited range, slow to get to 60 and low top speed. It's a city car!
As they said, it's perfect for the job it's supposed to do and if you want something to do a different job, then buy that. They even started by pointing out that EV users, by now, are use to the idea of buying a car that does "a job" and hiring the few times that it doesn't. But Arb drives significant distances, frequently enough that it's an issue.

[Arborbridge]

Meanwhile I watched a great review of Europe's cheapest BEV. Not a bell or whistle in sight. The reviewer loved it for what it is. It's useless for Arb though. Limited range, slow to get to 60 and low top speed. It's a city car!
As they said, it's perfect for the job it's supposed to do and if you want something to do a different job, then buy that. They even started by pointing out that EV users, by now, are use to the idea of buying a car that does "a job" and hiring the few times that it doesn't. But Arb drives significant distances, frequently enough that it's an issue.

Good post. Just on the subject of driving significant distances, most of my driving is actually very local and the EV would be perfect. I can live with the occasionally journey - a few times a year - when I might go 200+ miles rather than the more usual 100 miles max. I'm gambling on the electrical system improving in the next year or two, so the worry about it will not be so urgent.

However, we must all ask, why should we put up with such restraints when we can be sure of motoring 220 miles to Devon and back without going anywhere near a fuel station, let alone worrying if the equipment is occupied or broken when I need to refuel (in the case of an EV possibly, actually probably, involving a detour).


Arb.