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But I only looked at it for a moment ...

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9873210
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Re: But I only looked at it for a moment ...

#518332

Postby 9873210 » July 30th, 2022, 3:05 pm

Lootman wrote:
Some people do not like to use the word "accident" because they think it implies that means no blame or fault. But that is not the case at all - you can be involved in an accident where you are fully to blame for it because of negligence, recklessness etc. People go to prison for that in some cases.

The opposite of "accident" is "deliberate" or "intentional".

The opposite of "at fault" is "not at fault" or "blameless".

Two different things.

Googling "accident definition" the first result is "an unfortunate incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally, typically resulting in damage or injury." Both "unexpected" and "unintentional". Unexpected implies no blame. But if you have a driver's license your supposed to have read and understood the Highway Code so unexpected requires deliberate ignorance.

A deeper dive gives additional definitions with various combinations of intention and expected. You may choose whichever definition you want to use, but you can't choose what definition other people hear. There are a good many people who believe, with a sound knowledge of English, that all accidents are unexpected and therefor blameless. The way to avoid this ambiguity is to avoid using "accident" as a synonym for "crash". OTOH some people want ambiguity and do anything they can to avoid clarity.

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Re: But I only looked at it for a moment ...

#518335

Postby Lootman » July 30th, 2022, 3:16 pm

9873210 wrote:There are a good many people who believe, with a sound knowledge of English, that all accidents are unexpected and therefor blameless. The way to avoid this ambiguity is to avoid using "accident" as a synonym for "crash". OTOH some people want ambiguity and do anything they can to avoid clarity.

The word "accident" is not a synonym for "crash". The latter includes incidents that are caused deliberately and so the word "accident" would never apply anyway. If someone commits suicide by intentionally crashing their car into a tree, nobody would call that an accident. But it was still a crash. So there are more crashes than there are accidents.

I believe that most reasonable people would accept the idea that some accidents (i.e. unintended crashes) come with blame attached and some do not. By trying just a little too hard to avoid using the word "accident" one insinuates that all crashes have an element of blame or fault, and that is not the case.

The people I encounter who have declared war on the word "accident" are generally activists for road safety, particularly on behalf of pedestrians and cyclists. They seek to twist language to promote their agenda. That may be an understandable motive but I think it smacks of sloppy thinking and the purposeful manipulation of language for a specific political cause.

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Re: But I only looked at it for a moment ...

#518355

Postby 9873210 » July 30th, 2022, 5:35 pm

Lootman wrote:The word "accident" is not a synonym for "crash".

https://www.google.com/search?q=synonym+for+crash

I argue that accident and crash are used as synonyms but should not be.
You argue that accident and crash are not synonyms and therefor have no problem if they are used as synonyms.

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Re: But I only looked at it for a moment ...

#518358

Postby Lootman » July 30th, 2022, 5:45 pm

9873210 wrote:You argue that accident and crash are not synonyms and therefor have no problem if they are used as synonyms.

I do have a problem with it because it is semantically and logically incorrect. To put it another way there are three cases:

1) A crash was caused deliberately. It was therefore not an accident and the driver is at fault

2) A crash was accidental, but no fault is assigned to a driver

3) A crash was accidental, and fault is assigned to a driver

So it is misleading to use the two words as synonyms or as being equivalent.


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