Elderly relative driving

[ClaudiusTheIdiot]

An elderly (90+) relative for whom I have lasting power of attorney has recently had his driving licence returned after it was removed about five years ago for medical reasons. He is looking forward to driving again very soon, and has most things in place including insurance and MoT.

His physical state is a good deal deteriorated from before, but he has plenty of self confidence. I was previously uneasy about his driving, having been driven by him a number of times; but he has a long accident free record. I have tried to dissuade him on the grounds that driving and parking is a hassle and that returning to driving after such a long interval means that he is likely to come to grief, or hurt someone else. None of this reduces his cheery self confidence and enthusiasm.

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

[Dod101]

Just because you have a Power of Attorney does not, as I am sure you know, give you either any responsibility nor rights as far as the relative driving is concerned. Has he had to have a medical to have his licence restored? If so then there is nothing you can do; if not then you may be able to speak to his GP if you know of any grounds for concern, such as his eyesight but presumably his optician has checked that.

Experience with really elderly friends would suggest that they will know when they should not be driving but the other side is that it often gives them a good deal of self confidence to be driving again.

It is probably impossible for you to stop him.

Dod

[doolally]

After 5 years away from driving, he must be a bit rusty. Can you persuade him to have 3-4 sessions with a driving instructor who can make a professional assessment?
doolally

[DrFfybes]

After 5 years away from driving, he must be a bit rusty. Can you persuade him to have 3-4 sessions with a driving instructor who can make a professional assessment?
doolally

This.

The IAM and RoSPA (I think) do assessments specifically for older drivers, so in his own car..

But first, make sure his eyesight is still up to scratch.

Paul

[Gerry557]

Some of the elderly drivers I know tend to adjust there driving habits to their reduced abilities. Some won't go on motorways other limit the distance to just a few miles so supermarket or family trips etc.

The 5 year gap I think is your biggest issue. Has the car changed too. An automatic might help.

The advice above regarding additional lessons would be my way forward.

[Dod101]

Some of the elderly drivers I know tend to adjust there driving habits to their reduced abilities. Some won't go on motorways other limit the distance to just a few miles so supermarket or family trips etc.

The 5 year gap I think is your biggest issue. Has the car changed too. An automatic might help.

The advice above regarding additional lessons would be my way forward.

Were you the driver that would be fine, but the OP is not and the driver sounds pretty confident. Some gentle advice might be a good thing but that is all he can do.

The thing is unless he is banned on medical grounds such as eyesight, it is entirely up to the driver and no one else has any say.

Dod

[AF62]

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

Tell the DVLA. They have this form for you to inform them of such matters - I have concerns over a person's fitness to drive and I wish to tell the DVLA
https://contact.dvla.gov.uk/driver/capt ... &locale=en

They will then take whatever steps they consider are needed to confirm whether the person is fit to drive or not.

[chas49]

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

Tell the DVLA. They have this form for you to inform them of such matters - I have concerns over a person's fitness to drive and I wish to tell the DVLA
https://contact.dvla.gov.uk/driver/capt ... &locale=en

They will then take whatever steps they consider are needed to confirm whether the person is fit to drive or not.

I would assume from the facts the OP has given that the DVLA are happy to return the licence. According to the DVLA website, when a licence has been removed on medical grounds, a doctor has to confirm that it is appropriate for the licence to be returned. And it appears this has happened. "He's forgotten how to drive / he's over-confident" etc don't appear to be valid grounds from removal of a licence.

[AF62]

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

Tell the DVLA. They have this form for you to inform them of such matters - I have concerns over a person's fitness to drive and I wish to tell the DVLA
https://contact.dvla.gov.uk/driver/capt ... &locale=en

They will then take whatever steps they consider are needed to confirm whether the person is fit to drive or not.

I would assume from the facts the OP has given that the DVLA are happy to return the licence. According to the DVLA website, when a licence has been removed on medical grounds, a doctor has to confirm that it is appropriate for the licence to be returned. And it appears this has happened. "He's forgotten how to drive / he's over-confident" etc don't appear to be valid grounds from removal of a licence.

"a doctor", but which doctor. If it was the elderly driver's GP then many are reluctant to say no to their patients.

However if the DVLA get a third party report then what do they do? File it in the 'everything is OK because the GP said it was and we will not be blamed if they kill someone' pile or perhaps ask for additional reports from independent medical specialists to make sure.

Frankly I have no idea, but if the form is submitted and nothing further is done, then at least they have followed the process and done all they can do, other than taking the keys away.

[didds]

As others have said above, I doubt there is anything you can in reality do.

All I can suggest is a bit of emotional blackmail - an extenion of what you have alreadys aid maybe.

something like YOU are worried, concerned that HE would hacve an accident and that to assuage YOUR fears some reminder lessons with an instructor etc etc

And you could also make a point of refusing any offers of lifts etc and just be blunt that you dont feel safe in the vehicle with him driving.

didds

[88V8]

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

A friend in his 80s has recently bought a new Honda hybrid, did try to dissuade him on the grounds that it is laden with superfluous gimmicks, but he loves it and the gimmicks.... he drives extensively all over the country, very slowly... sometimes with a line of irate drivers behind him... but is accident-free and has been for many years.

My father carried on driving despite less than perfect sight, which one can if one only drives where one knows, again accident-free.

I think one should leave people to make their own decisions. When you are 90, you might reasonably resent people telling you what you can and cannot do, even with the best of intentions.

V8

[pje16]

he drives extensively all over the country, very slowly... sometimes with a line of irate drivers behind him... but is accident-free and has been for many years.
V8

never had an accident but has seen hundreds (sorry, just teasing)

[Dod101]

I am concerned that he might do some serious damage to someone, including himself, but it seems impossible to stop him. Please does anyone have any good ideas?

A friend in his 80s has recently bought a new Honda hybrid, did try to dissuade him on the grounds that it is laden with superfluous gimmicks, but he loves it and the gimmicks.... he drives extensively all over the country, very slowly... sometimes with a line of irate drivers behind him... but is accident-free and has been for many years.

My father carried on driving despite less than perfect sight, which one can if one only drives where one knows, again accident-free.

I think one should leave people to make their own decisions. When you are 90, you might reasonably resent people telling you what you can and cannot do, even with the best of intentions.

V8

I agree with that although if someone is driving with less than perfect sight, that could well be against the law.
My father in law was well known latterly around his small town. He used to drive with his chequebook near at hand and when I eventually sold his car after he died, it was covered in scratches and dents. I lived some way away so had no input as to whether he drove or not. I was glad of that.

Dod

[bungeejumper]

"a doctor", but which doctor. If it was the elderly driver's GP then many are reluctant to say no to their patients.

Indeed. Doctors are on the horns of a dilemma here, because a car is often central to an elderly person's social life, and it's the social life that keeps dementia and depression at bay. In rural areas like ours, losing your licence is a real blow. Doctors do discuss this need for a balancing act between themselves - I'd prefer to think that not many would really turn a blind eye to a serious developing problem. (Er, if you see what I mean?)

Having said that, there are taxis and (sometimes!) buses, and when it's time to stop it's probably already past the time to stop. We had to take my old dad's car keys away after he started doing risky things at road intersections - but dammit, we were his children, and he was showing definite early signs of dementia. (Which sadly became worse, so at least we had the reassurance of knowing that we'd done the right thing.)

But gosh, it was a pretty gruesome moment when I finally drove his car away and sold it. Fortunately, he recovered his emotional balance quite quickly, and eventually he agreed that it was really quite a relief not to be expected to drive any more. I'd say we were lucky there - some oldsters insist on going on until they hit something.

Age UK has a pretty good guide at https://www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/a ... at_inf.pdf . Good luck

[pje16]

My dad, 92, hasn't driven for 2 years as he has problems with his feet
he's almost better now and thinks he can drive again
The last time I was in a car with him, the dotted white line in the road was running under the middle of the bonnet
He has a 19-year-old car with just 5,000 on the clock, shows how much he uses it
My brother and I are concerned
the forthcoming extension to the ULEZ charge is putting him off
My brother has said for our peace of mind he's going to offer to buy the car from him

[AF62]

Having said that, there are taxis and (sometimes!) buses, and when it's time to stop it's probably already past the time to stop. We had to take my old dad's car keys away after he started doing risky things at road intersections - but dammit, we were his children, and he was showing definite early signs of dementia. (Which sadly became worse, so at least we had the reassurance of knowing that we'd done the right thing.)

But gosh, it was a pretty gruesome moment when I finally drove his car away and sold it. Fortunately, he recovered his emotional balance quite quickly, and eventually he agreed that it was really quite a relief not to be expected to drive any more. I'd say we were lucky there - some oldsters insist on going on until they hit something.

Fortunately with my father he himself recognised that the time had come to quit and he instigated the conversation with me seeking confirmation that I didn't disagree.

He certainly missed the freedom of driving, but recognised that he didn't want to end his driving by having an accident, and god forbid hurting or killing someone.

[bungeejumper]

Fortunately with my father he himself recognised that the time had come to quit and he instigated the conversation with me seeking confirmation that I didn't disagree.

He certainly missed the freedom of driving, but recognised that he didn't want to end his driving by having an accident, and god forbid hurting or killing someone.

I have the most enormous respect for people like your dad. I can hardly imagine what it must be like after a lifetime of having the freedom of the road. But courage and honesty don't even begin to describe it. I just hope I'll have the good grace to do the same one day.

Now, how do I persuade my wife to let this 72 year old have one last big motorbike?

Born to be Wild BJ

[scrumpyjack]

Could you point out that Prince Phillip thought he could drive and that didn't turn out well!

[pje16]

Could you point out that Prince Phillip thought he could drive and that didn't turn out well!

probably because he had no experience of driving in the real world

[6Tricia]

I gave up driving in 2017 at 82 when getting into and out of my vehicle became difficult and painful. I've managed to stay mobile though by purchasing a mobility scooter which gets me out and about locally!

Maybe a suggestion for your dad?

Tricia