What cars should be on my short list?

[Clariman]

I might replace my current 4 year old car shortly. Why replace it? Because I can - and because it is diesel so doesn't have a bright future.

Here are my broad requirements ....

• Can accommodate 4 adults very comfortably, 5 adults reasonably comfortably when needed - although most of the time it will be just Mrs C and I.
• A petrol engine that won't feel uncomfortable/forced when cruising at 70 to 80mph
• An engine that can overtake well on an 'A' road by dropping down a gear or two and flooring it a bit (my diesel is good at that)
• Decent sized boot so we could tour in Europe, take luggage and still squeeze in a couple of cases of wine for the return journey
• Comfortable ride for long journeys - I'm not into a sporty ride.
• Good bluetooth phone system, pref with voice activated dialling. I would miss that if I didn't have it.
• Integrated satnav is useful but not essential
• Nice interior - probably choose leather and nice trim
• Mrs C would want heated front passenger seat
• Reasonable sound system with ability to play radio, CD (maybe) and mp3 or from Android phone
• Parking sensors and rear mirror are a 'nice to have'.
• Electric adjustable seats are a 'nice to have'
• Warranty - minimum 3 years
• Style of car - recent cars have been saloon cars but there appear to be fewer around, so open to suggestions
• Brand image - don't really care. I would NOT choose a brand for brand's sake. But if a posh brand really was a better, good value car, then I wouldn't let my natural inverted-snobbery get in my way!

BUDGET - tricky. For once in my life, I do have some money about to burn a hole in my pocket (decided to take AVCs as a tax-free lump sum, which I had not planned/expected to do). However, good value for money is really important to me. My current car was probably around £21K new, having previously bought 1 year old low mileage ones for around £18K. While I could afford a car at £30K (or £50K), I would REALLY STRUGGLE to spend that amount of money on a depreciating bit of tin. So I think my preferred budget would be £18K to £25K but might go a bit higher if it really was a very nice car. My current car should trade in for around £10K.

Cars I have had in the past which I really liked (mostly company cars) - Volvo S60, Audi A4, Honda Accord. The first two of those might be out of my budget and the latter isn't made any more!

Clariman

[flint]

Toyota Avensis is excellent value for money. As good discounts are easy to negotiate do not be put off by list price.

However, if willing to spend more the Mazda 6 is not a bad choice. The local Mazda dealers i visited were bordering on offensive when I suggested that a reasonable price was that offered by Car WOW.

[Slarti]

I think my Avensis is a very good car, even though it is a 2011 auto.

Of your list,
4 large adults + 1 smaller one. The larger ones were all over 5' 10" and well set
The petrol is 1.8l does 50mpg cruising at 65 but is happy cruising at 85mpg for over 2.5 hours on an autobahn though it drops to 40mpg
I don't do much overtaking on single carriageway A roads, but if I do floor it, it makes a good push.
The boot is Tardis like, in that it looks small, but goes back for ever. The only downside is that the boot hatch is too small to put in some items that you'd want to. we gave our dining room chairs their 50 year service a couple of months back and had to use Mrs S' Yaris as they wouldn't go through the hole. But, I can put 6 large cases, 2 backpacks, assorted coats and boots and 4 cases of brandy in. And if I want more, the back seats fold down.
Comfort depends on the spec. Mine is.
Bluetooth phone and audio work a treat, but no voice control. Perhaps they've added it in the last 6 years.
If buying a new vehicle I wouldn't touch integrated satnav with a barge pole. The ones on phones are far superior and don't cost a bomb to update.
I don't like leather, but I believe it is available.
Ditto heated seats
Sound system is great, at least for heavy metal. Radio, CD, USB & bluetooth. I prefer radio and USB. I think I have about 60 albums on each of my 2 in the car.
No parking sensors, but a good rear view camera. Door mirrors are electric and suit me.
Electric adjustable seats are on higher spec models than mine
Warranty, I think it is 5 years
Style. Saloon or estate
Brand. Goes for reliability.

Down sides
A bit boring to look at
Electric parking brake
No headlight washers

Watch out for
Gearbox. Avoid the fake autos. Manuals and CVT are excellent.

Err?

Go and look at the Toyota dealer.

Or the Lexus one, which are the up market Toyota market


Slarti

[staffordian]

Only a minor comment, but I would echo the thoughts about built in satnavs.

Whilst there is undeniably a certain convenience to a built in model, they seem to be a licence for the manufacturer to print money.

My Nissan has one and the cost of an SD card to upgrade the maps is around £140 according to the forum for my model. You probably wouldn't need to update each year but even two or three upgrades would add up...

For that you can get a decent stand alone with lifetime updates.

[tea42]

Had my ASX 4 years, great motor. Petrol or diesel available. Every conceivable extra.Sat Nav an extra these days giving you a choice. Google maps on your phone beats Garmin's. The reviews are sometimes not kind and criticisms leave owners wondering what they are on about? The most comfortable car I have ever had and I have had lots.Meets all your criteria.

[Clariman]

Thank you. A few votes for Avensis, Mazda S6 and ASX. Any others?

[redsturgeon]

I think you should be able to get the S60 within your £25k budget. The range starts at £22k and discounts will be available.

John

[bungeejumper]

Can't fault my Toyota, even though it's an Auris estate, not an Avensis, and you might want something with more oomph than the 124 bhp 1.6 petrol that I've got. (Huge rear loadspace, but at the expense of slightly less rear seat legroom than some.) Toyota's handling is generally tuned for comfort rather than for seat-of-the-pants cornering thrills, but mine hangs onto the bends very reliably, and has been faultless in the 12 months I've had it. (I bought it at 18 months for just over £10K, or approx half of its new sticker price - not sure what that says about depreciation?)

You might find that the otherwise excellent Mazda 6 is a little too 'firm' for your requirements - I didn't care for the ride, personally. And generally, it sounds from your description as though you'd be better off going for something with 'standard' tyres rather than skinny-rimmed 19 inchers.

I'd be inclined to give CarWow a go if you're shopping for price on a new car, because there don't seem to be any catches. I idly put in a call for dealer bids on a new Kia when I was car shopping last year, and I had five or six emailed offers from main dealers (@ 7% to 9% discounts). None of them pestered me after their initial offers (in fact I'd decided against the car) - I think they each gave me one email nudge, but that was it. A positive experience, all things considered.

BJ

[Clariman]

Thank you chaps. I had pretty much ruled out the Volvo S60 as being beyond my budget to get some of the stuff I would want (leather seats etc), but John saying it might be within it prompted me to look, but I was still doubtful about getting the spec I wanted. Flint then mentioned CarWOW in passing which my brain must have logged.

Anyway, googling half an hour ago, CarWOW came up, so I put in the details speculatively for a top of the range S60 (SE Lux Nav) and got an offer of over £7K off list price, bringing it within budget. Only issue is all offers have an expiry of the end of quarter.

C

[redsturgeon]

Thank you chaps. I had pretty much ruled out the Volvo S60 as being beyond my budget to get some of the stuff I would want (leather seats etc), but John saying it might be within it prompted me to look, but I was still doubtful about getting the spec I wanted. Flint then mentioned CarWOW in passing which my brain must have logged.

Anyway, googling half an hour ago, CarWOW came up, so I put in the details speculatively for a top of the range S60 (SE Lux Nav) and got an offer of over £7K off list price, bringing it within budget. Only issue is all offers have an expiry of the end of quarter.

C

Yes, but there will be another offer then...it may even be a better offer!

Edit: Just looked at drivethedeal and they have a S60 T4 SE Nav and Leather for less than 20K!

John

[Clariman]

Yes, but there will be another offer then...it may even be a better offer!

Indeed

Edit: Just looked at drivethedeal and they have a S60 T4 SE Nav and Leather for less than 20K!

John

Hmm. Do you have to request a quote to see that or is that listed somewhere on the website? I can't see it.

[redsturgeon]

Yes, but there will be another offer then...it may even be a better offer!

Indeed

Edit: Just looked at drivethedeal and they have a S60 T4 SE Nav and Leather for less than 20K!

John

Hmm. Do you have to request a quote to see that or is that listed somewhere on the website? I can't see it.

You have to give a few details to request a quote and then it displays on the site, takes about a minute.

Drivethedeal has been my go to site for five years for this sort of thing. I usually get a quote then go to my local dealer and they will invariably match it.

John

[swill453]

Only issue is all offers have an expiry of the end of quarter.

Are you aware that the new VED ("road tax") regime comes in for new cars registered after 1st April? It's quite extensively changed.

Scott.

[redsturgeon]

Only issue is all offers have an expiry of the end of quarter.

Are you aware that the new VED ("road tax") regime comes in for new cars registered after 1st April? It's quite extensively changed.

Scott.

For something of moderate emissions (120-140) it won't make much difference, eg, the S60 that Clariman is looking at. For low emission cars or high emission cars it can have a significant impact due to either going from zero to £140 yearly tax in the case of low emissions or the high initial tax rate for high emitters.

John

[Clariman]

Only issue is all offers have an expiry of the end of quarter.

Are you aware that the new VED ("road tax") regime comes in for new cars registered after 1st April? It's quite extensively changed.

Scott.

Thanks - yes I had seen that. As far as I can see, it won't make a great deal of difference to me.

[Clariman]

Well one of the Volvo garages (one near me) has quoted a very good price - deal expires on 31st March - but they don't have a car with the T4 engine that I can test drive. Oh well, looks like they may have lost a sale.

[ten0rman]

We've an Avensis Estate with the 1.8 petrol engine. Bought new almost 4 years ago and used daily for normal knocking about and including caravan towing when we decide to go off. Overall average mpg after 54K miles is 38.5. Repairs is one internal mirror (knocked off by Mrs T), one headlight bulb (it turns out they are specials so I now carry one of each as spares), one battery (after 3 1/2 years and replaced by a Bosch 5 year warranty battery) and one set of tyres (which should last to circa 60K).

We find it a bit hard/bouncy with only two up, but more weight makes it much more comfortable. Acceleration nothing to write home about unless its clogged through the gears, but these days I'm no longer bothered about the traffic light grand prix, being more bothered about smooth driving.

With two of us, there is plenty of boot space, and with the back seat down loads more.

So far it's proving to be the best car we've ever had, maybe not as comfortable as the Peugeot 405, but certainly incomparably better than the Focus we had.

Regards,

ten0rman

[BT63]

....Thanks - yes I had seen that. As far as I can see, it won't make a great deal of difference to me.....

If you're buying new, VED will be only a minor 'cost of ownership' compared to depreciation. The £25k you're planning on spending will be worth £0 in about 14 years time when the car become uneconomical to repair - that's £1.8k/yr 'cost of ownership', although in the first year it'll be more like £10k cost of ownership through depreciation.
VED is also only a minor expense compared to fuel costs and servicing/maintenance.

I wouldn't choose a car solely because it saved me a few tens of Pounds per year on VED.
In fact, one of our household's cars is in the top VED bracket - £535 when I tax it in a few days time - but we have the car because we like it very much.

[Sobraon]

I might be in a similar position so might I suggest you consider a 2016 Mitsubishi PHEV GX4/5 hybid?

Petrol engine for the longer journeys but electric for around town (30 mile claimed range). Depreciation in the first year is fairly steep ( a good thing here ) and cars registered after 1st July 2015 have a 5 year, 62,500 mile warranty.

IMHO the 2016 GX4h is probably the 'sweet spot' ( I would not consider a GX3h/GX3h+ model).

[BT63]

I might be in a similar position so might I suggest you consider a 2016 Mitsubishi PHEV GX4/5 hybid?

Petrol engine for the longer journeys but electric for around town (30 mile claimed range). Depreciation in the first year is fairly steep ( a good thing here ) and cars registered after 1st July 2015 have a 5 year, 62,500 mile warranty.

IMHO the 2016 GX4h is probably the 'sweet spot' ( I would not consider a GX3h/GX3h+ model).

Batteries will have a limited number of recharge cycles. With every recharge the battery capacity will slightly decrease. Some vehicles used almost exclusively on their electric power have been known to be down to half battery capacity within a year.

For long fast journeys (motorways, dual carriageways) with 'only' 120BHP petrol engine to haul along a two-ton SUV while charging the batteries, running aircon and all on-board electrics and gadgets, that engine is going to have to work very hard. 30mpg on motorway runs is what I've been told by real owners.

Without electric support - batteries depleted - acceleration and overtaking will be painfully slow. Even with electric boost the claimed 0-60 acceleration time of 11s is only average acceleration ability.
In fact without electric boost I'd bet the PHEV would be outrun by a basic 1-litre town runabout (e.g. Citroen C1, Hyundai i10, Vauxhall Viva, VW Up).