The Lemon Fool

Hi folks,

Our little rose garden is doing really well this year. We have about 10 small bushes, most were planted between 2 and 6 years ago, and there are 3 which I rescued this winter from one of our ongoing ground clearance operations.

However one bush is doing a bit too well! It has some nice blooms at about 14-18" above the ground (most of the others' blooms are probably around this level, perhaps a little lower). The "problem", is that it also a few very vigourous shoots (with some flower buds), shooting up about a foot higher still, which is out of proportion to the rest of the bed, and probably encroaches a little on the light for others.

My idea is to today, to cut about a foot (i.e. these shoots) from this bush. Perhaps they will flower if put in a vase? Since I believe this will restore proportion, and give a couple of it's neighbours a chance to "catch up" with this fellow.

My question is: Is this a good idea, so long as I'm very clean with the cuts, or will it damage this very enthusiastic individual?

thanks Matt

Roses are pretty tough, and they'll take a lot of hard pruning and come back just fine. The late Christopher Lloyd, who'd inherited the Lutyens/Jekyll gardens at Great Dixter, used to prune his world-famous roses with a hedge trimmer.

Since these roses clearly aren't ramblers, they'll be happy enough to adopt whatever shape you want them to be. There is a question, though, as to whether yours are repeat flowering or whether they're the 'old school' roses that bloom only once. Any idea of their names?

BJ

You may just encourage it to put out even more shoots as it is in the middle of the growing season. I would leave it and see what it does by the end of the season. If it is much more vigorous than the others and grows much higher I would move it over the winter.

I don't think it will damage the rose itself to cut it as you are proposing. generally roses are pretty tough. I see BJ has said much the same.

Dod

bungeejumper wrote:Roses are pretty tough, and they'll take a lot of hard pruning and come back just fine. The late Christopher Lloyd, who'd inherited the Lutyens/Jekyll gardens at Great Dixter, used to prune his world-famous roses with a hedge trimmer.

Ha ha! I thought as much.

Since these roses clearly aren't ramblers, they'll be happy enough to adopt whatever shape you want them to be. There is a question, though, as to whether yours are repeat flowering or whether they're the 'old school' roses that bloom only once. Any idea of their names?

I don't know their names I'm afraid - even those which we bought. We just choose a variety of different colours, and whilst I insisted on Floribunda, Mel did manage to get her way (only partially!), and I relented so that 2 or 3 of them are Hybrid Tea. I just googled and discovered that (apparently) both FBs and HTs are repeaters.

Dod101 wrote:You may just encourage it to put out even more shoots as it is in the middle of the growing season. I would leave it and see what it does by the end of the season. If it is much more vigorous than the others and grows much higher I would move it over the winter.

Thanks Dod - yeah I bet it will put out more. TBH it's not massively more vigourous. The main things being 1) I'm a bit of a perfectionist and 2) It's close to a couple of the "rescued" ones I mentioned in the OP, and I really want them to get the max light and air possible in their new location. As is often the case they are all fighting each other and the small fruit trees, privet hedge etc. for precious resources.

I don't think it will damage the rose itself to cut it as you are proposing. generally roses are pretty tough. I see BJ has said much the same.

Ta. I think I'll cut it, Mel will get something to put in a vase too!

thanks Matt

I read the post title as 'trimming nose bushes'. A subliminal consequence of lockdown and advancing years!

neversay wrote:I read the post title as 'trimming nose bushes'. A subliminal consequence of lockdown and advancing years!

I thought you were being completely bonkers at first.

Then I remembered, that I, at the tender age of 52, found myself some months back, using the nail snippers to address for the first time a nasty nasal pube all of my very own.

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:I thought you were being completely bonkers at first.

Then I remembered, that I, at the tender age of 52, found myself some months back, using the nail snippers to address for the first time a nasty nasal pube all of my very own.

They're only going to get worse, don't try this whilst wearing a mask

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKpB2abWKR8

RC

ReformedCharacter wrote:They're only going to get worse, don't try this whilst wearing a mask

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKpB2abWKR8

I've seen that done, and in a pub too. By a bunch of burly blokes who seemed intent on proving to each other how macho they were.

O/T, but one of these just about saved my bro-in-law's marriage when the dreaded (and "disgusting!") middle-aged itch struck: https://www.argos.co.uk/product/3336984? I wouldn't be without mine, that's for sure.

BJ

ReformedCharacter wrote:

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:I thought you were being completely bonkers at first.

Then I remembered, that I, at the tender age of 52, found myself some months back, using the nail snippers to address for the first time a nasty nasal pube all of my very own.

They're only going to get worse, don't try this whilst wearing a mask

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKpB2abWKR8

RC

That's hilarious! "There's nowt as queer as folk".

TheMotorcycleBoy wrote:The "problem", is that it also a few very vigourous shoots (with some flower buds), shooting up about a foot higher still...

...My idea is to today, to cut about a foot (i.e. these shoots) from this bush....

My question is: Is this a good idea, so long as I'm very clean with the cuts, or will it damage this very enthusiastic individual?

Roses are usually grafted onto a vigorous wild rootstock. Where are these rampant shoots coming from? If it's from below the graft, or even from below ground, then they should be removed completely. They will be from the wild root stock, will not have the flowers you expect, and will sap the strength from the rest of the bush.

Only keep and trim them back if they appear from higher up in the bush.

Breelander wrote:Roses are usually grafted onto a vigorous wild rootstock. Where are these rampant shoots coming from? If it's from below the graft, or even from below ground, then they should be removed completely. They will be from the wild root stock, will not have the flowers you expect, and will sap the strength from the rest of the bush.

I hadn't considered that possibility, Bree, but it's a question that's worth asking. Matt, shoots from the rootstock are usually on older bushes, but there's a first time for everything.

Have a close look at the shoots. The stem colour, the shape and size of the thorns and the leaf shape (including the number of veins) ought to be similar to the ones on the rest of the bush. If not, show them no mercy.

BJ

A ha. I didn't realise roses were grafted TBH. I'll check the offending bush sometime tomorrow.....alas I have retired from the outdoor heat today.

Breelander wrote:Roses are usually grafted onto a vigorous wild rootstock. Where are these rampant shoots coming from? If it's from below the graft, or even from below ground, then they should be removed completely. They will be from the wild root stock, will not have the flowers you expect, and will sap the strength from the rest of the bush.

Well the curiosity was overwhelming and I braved the inferno. I can report that the shoots from the light pink flowered plant which I snipped back earlier (approximately flush with remainder of the plant's height) were clearly from the bush itself not the root stock. However... I noticed that one of the other bushes with nice peachy blooms has dark green leaves for the most part, but it also (currently ) has two shoots, slightly higher than the flowering shoots, whose leaves are a fair bit lighter. I glanced down and yes they come from the ground, probably off the root stock, hard to tell without getting too surgical (definitely too hot for that right now), since we've chucking a few coffee grounds around the area of late as additional plant food. The operation is booked for tomorrow.

Only keep and trim them back if they appear from higher up in the bush.

Yup - over and out.

Thanks to all of you for adding to my horticultural know-how. I will require some advice on one of our yew saplings another day!

Matt

Many years ago, my Round Table had a talk from a local rose grower. Inevitably the question of when and how to prune rose bushes came up.

His answer was that he did it on Boxing Day, because he always had that day off. As to how, he said "I put my knuckles on the ground and go snip, snip." What about hybrid tea roses? The same. Obviously not applicable to standard roses.

TJH