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Vegan children stunted

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88V8
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Vegan children stunted

#420797

Postby 88V8 » June 19th, 2021, 8:19 pm

Children raised on a vegan diet may have healthier hearts and less body fat than omnivores, but they grow up shorter and with weaker bones, a study has revealed.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/lifestyle/new-study-looks-at-the-dangers-of-a-vegan-diet-for-infants/5IMQTQHWQS3IU3S5BYDYZTGQPY/

The original paper eludes me, but this paper of 2008 echoes the reported findings https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/89/5/1627S/4596952 as regards benefits, as well as vitamin deficencies and potential bone problems.

Imv, it is questionable whether a diet that requires vitamin supplements can really be considered healthy.

And I certainly think that parents have no business imposing food fads on children as young as five.
Vegetarian perhaps... vegan, no.

V8 (omnivore)

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420798

Postby Mike4 » June 19th, 2021, 8:22 pm

Or could it be cause and effect are being confused?

Might it be that people of smaller stature are drawn to, or predisposed to adopting a vegan diet? Or more specifically, imposing it on their offspring?

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420824

Postby bungeejumper » June 19th, 2021, 10:56 pm

I think this story has been knocking around since the seventies, when the vegan population was hardly there at all (and was frequently abstaining for religious reasons).

The crux of it, as far as I can be @rsed to remember, was that a vegan diet was short on nutrients that were essential to the development of children under four/six/ten/place your bets, but that it was safe enough for teenagers and adults.

BJ

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420826

Postby mark88man » June 19th, 2021, 11:00 pm

Non vegan children more likely to be overweight is my takeaway - honestly do you have to go after anyone who has a different lifestyle and try and prove them wrong!

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420848

Postby Itsallaguess » June 20th, 2021, 6:51 am

bungeejumper wrote:
I think this story has been knocking around since the seventies, when the vegan population was hardly there at all.


Was that the first sign that there was an issue?

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420851

Postby GrahamPlatt » June 20th, 2021, 8:31 am

It is true that a poor diet in childhood “stunts” growth.
This knowledge has been around for hundreds of years, affecting whole nations. E.g the Chinese and Japanese have tended to small stature. However, within a couple of generations, émigrées from those countries to America tend to assume the stature of the indigenous population. Likewise, closer to home, before and into the 20th century the Welsh. The effect is most pronounced in utero, where the mother is undernourished, but while the size of the body is reduced, the brain is spared and underfeeding (unless extreme) does not lead to a reduction in intelligence. There are some fascinating studies of the effects of famines (e.g. the Dutch famine) showing that epigenetic “memories” of such events persist through the generations.

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#420856

Postby Urbandreamer » June 20th, 2021, 9:35 am

Itsallaguess wrote:
bungeejumper wrote:
I think this story has been knocking around since the seventies, when the vegan population was hardly there at all.


Was that the first sign that there was an issue?

Cheers,

Itsallaguess


Actually there has been "an issue" for lifetimes. It's just that the finger hasn't pointed at vegans. Anyone heard of rickets? Since WWII we have been fortifying white bread with vitamin D, yet the problem still exists. Currently the suggestion is that if you have a dark skin pigment in the UK you might be well advised to take additional supplements.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/heal ... 95686.html
There were 101,136 admissions last year where vitamin D deficiency was a primary or secondary factor in the admission, a rise of 34 per cent in a year, analysis of NHS Digital data shows.
(2018).

It's FAR from unknown that a "standard" diet may lead to problems because that "standard" diet is lacking in something.

Here is another quote, from a group that argues for adding the supplements into everyone's food (fortifying), rather than expecting them to tayler the supplements to their diet or their condition.

[quote]Between 1900 and 1950 there were 3 million cases and 100,000 deaths from pellagra in the USA. This was because subsistence farmers in some southern states relied upon the so-called 3M (meat, maize and molasses) diet which was made up mainly of maize meal, pork fat and molasses.
https://drgeoffnutrition.wordpress.com/ ... on-policy/

Thiamine deficiency (beriberi) has been known for hundreds of years in areas with a rice based diet.
Iodine deficiency is another big diet problem worldwide.

Dare I suggest that those who actively think about their diet might be less prone to deficiencies?

FWIW I also am an omnivore though I was a vegetarian for a decade or so.

88V8
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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421140

Postby 88V8 » June 21st, 2021, 12:55 pm


servodude
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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421164

Postby servodude » June 21st, 2021, 2:53 pm

Urbandreamer wrote:Dare I suggest that those who actively think about their diet might be less prone to deficiencies?


Seems to be a safe bet that a lot of malnutrition is through ignorance (certainly in places where there isn't a deficiency of available variety of food)

Veganism might be the exception that proves the rule though
- it seems to be an extremely conscious choice

I don't doubt it's possible to eat healthily as a vegan but I do suspect that might be beyond the natural talents of kids

I honestly can't think of any vegetarians/vegans that I know who have made their kids comply.. and a few who have made sure their kids didn't abandon meat as youngsters (before their mid teens)
I suspect a lot of those who eat a more traditionally lacking diet might not care as much about what their kids consume

-sd

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421168

Postby Mike4 » June 21st, 2021, 2:59 pm

I heard a cracking comment a few years ago, said in all seriousness:

"I never realised Jim was a vegan, he doesn't look ill enough."

Lol!

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421171

Postby Urbandreamer » June 21st, 2021, 3:28 pm

servodude wrote:I don't doubt it's possible to eat healthily as a vegan but I do suspect that might be beyond the natural talents of kids
-sd


As I understand it B12 is the issue with a vegan diet. You can buy supplements or you can learn to like Marmite (other brands are available).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmite

Calcium and vitanine D are the important ones for bones. Almond, oat and soya milks are all good sources for these because they are fortified. Indeed they also often contain B12.

The study is quite interesting, though it has quite a small sample size and being based in Poland posibly wouldn't repeat in different countries.

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421220

Postby Mike4 » June 21st, 2021, 5:46 pm

Urbandreamer wrote:As I understand it B12 is the issue with a vegan diet. You can buy supplements or you can learn to like Marmite (other brands are available).


Just being mischievous, but are there really? I can't think of any!

(Vegemite does not contain B12 aiui.)

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421233

Postby Urbandreamer » June 21st, 2021, 6:14 pm

Mike4 wrote:
Just being mischievous, but are there really? I can't think of any!

(Vegemite does not contain B12 aiui.)


It's apparently added to the low salt version.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegemite

Mighty, the Aldi alternative to Marmite has B12, though the label does say in big letters "with added vitamins".
Meridian yeast extract also has it added.

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421448

Postby bungeejumper » June 22nd, 2021, 7:13 pm

servodude wrote:I honestly can't think of any vegetarians/vegans that I know who have made their kids comply.. and a few who have made sure their kids didn't abandon meat as youngsters (before their mid teens)

Our neighbours are devout veggies (but not vegans). Their problem is that they don't like the taste of vegetables. :|

They raised their kids on chips and pizza - they couldn't interest them at all in eating anything green. One of them studied to be a dietician (and is now a senior adviser at a large hospital). Within a month of starting her course, she became a convinced omnivore. Funny, that.

BJ

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Re: Vegan children stunted

#421637

Postby redsturgeon » June 23rd, 2021, 4:06 pm

Urbandreamer wrote:
Mike4 wrote:
Just being mischievous, but are there really? I can't think of any!

(Vegemite does not contain B12 aiui.)


It's apparently added to the low salt version.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegemite

Mighty, the Aldi alternative to Marmite has B12, though the label does say in big letters "with added vitamins".
Meridian yeast extract also has it added.



Most vegans will know to add nutritional yeast to their food to supplement B12.

John


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