Typing or not

[Loup321]

The small one said that at least she was learning to type, when she was writing on her tablet, but I disagree that pressing buttons with only 1 finger is typing. I don't consider that I can type, as I use only 5 fingers, and I don't use the correct shift buttons. So, is writing on a tablet the same as typing? Or a phone, using only 1 thumb?

[Itsallaguess]

In the case of a youngster, then I'd probably prefer to encouragingly describe it as 'learning to type', rather than being more dismissive with a 'you're not typing' approach...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

[Loup321]

In the case of a youngster, then I'd probably prefer to encouragingly describe it as 'learning to type', rather than being more dismissive with a 'you're not typing' approach...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

Yes, point taken. She is 10, and a reasoned debate is always a good thing, but I accept I could have come across as putting her down. She is learning where the letters are on a keyboard, and the outcome is typed. But the debate started getting heated (on the definition of "typing" rather than me getting at her), so I thought I'd ask here what the general opinion was on the word.

[Lootman]

I use two fingers on a proper keyboard, and one finger on a phone. I do not have a tablet. I consider that to be typing as the result is type.

Apply a Turing test. If you were in the next room reading my output but without knowing how I had produced it, how would you tell how many fingers I had used?

[UncleEbenezer]

I use two fingers on a proper keyboard, and one finger on a phone. I do not have a tablet. I consider that to be typing as the result is type.

Apply a Turing test. If you were in the next room reading my output but without knowing how I had produced it, how would you tell how many fingers I had used?

You just told us. Two fingers.

A familiar gesture.

OP: if she talks of typing, maybe you should seize on it and float the idea of learning touch-typing? Express it something along the lines of "real" or "expert" typing? If she bites, it's potentially a life skill. If not, nothing lost.

[jfgw]

I do not see how the technique is relevant to what it is. If it is pressing keys on a keyboard (or doing the equivalent on a virtual keyboard on a touch-screen) it does not matter (with respect to what you call it) how it is done. Typing is typing.

By the same argument, it is still "learning to type", although I suggest that such practice may be counterproductive if she is ever to want to learn to touch-type. Most people would probably take "learning to type" as meaning "learning to touch-type properly". It is like "learning" Morse code by memorising the dots and dashes on a chart — something that you should never do if you want to learn properly and achieve a good speed. Learning to type properly requires a proper keyboard and the correct learning strategy from a teacher, a book or possibly a series of youtube videos.

While I am not a typist, I typed the above using eight fingers and a thumb while (mostly) looking at the screen and not the keyboard. I can copy text from a book without taking my eyes off of that book. This is a skill well-worth learning but you can't do it on a touch-screen.


Julian F. G. W.

[swill453]

I do not see how the technique is relevant to what it is. If it is pressing keys on a keyboard (or doing the equivalent on a virtual keyboard on a touch-screen) it does not matter (with respect to what you call it) how it is done. Typing is typing.

By the same argument, it is still "learning to type", although I suggest that such practice may be counterproductive if she is ever to want to learn to touch-type. Most people would probably take "learning to type" as meaning "learning to touch-type properly". It is like "learning" Morse code by memorising the dots and dashes on a chart — something that you should never do if you want to learn properly and achieve a good speed. Learning to type properly requires a proper keyboard and the correct learning strategy from a teacher, a book or possibly a series of youtube videos.

While I am not a typist, I typed the above using eight fingers and a thumb while (mostly) looking at the screen and not the keyboard. I can copy text from a book without taking my eyes off of that book. This is a skill well-worth learning but you can't do it on a touch-screen.

That's true, but I'm in awe at how fast the younger generation can type with two thumbs on a phone, and that's definitely a useful skill in this day and age.

Scott.

[gryffron]

I'm in awe at how fast the younger generation can type with two thumbs on a phone, and that's definitely a useful skill in this day and age.

Today, yes. But last decade's texting on a 0-9 keypad is already totally defunct. By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

[xeny]

By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

How about any hint of privacy or confidentiality in a shared space?

[genou]

I'm in awe at how fast the younger generation can type with two thumbs on a phone, and that's definitely a useful skill in this day and age.

Today, yes. But last decade's texting on a 0-9 keypad is already totally defunct. By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

This is the key point. If you believe it will be voice dictation, chill. If not, get a copy of Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing, and a proper keyboard. Both of mine used it, and at least for now, touch typing is a huge bonus.

[Watis]

I'm in awe at how fast the younger generation can type with two thumbs on a phone, and that's definitely a useful skill in this day and age.

Today, yes. But last decade's texting on a 0-9 keypad is already totally defunct. By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

This is the key point. If you believe it will be voice dictation, chill. If not, get a copy of Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing, and a proper keyboard. Both of mine used it, and at least for now, touch typing is a huge bonus.

I second this. Having tried and failed with a few alternatives, Mavis Beacon worked for me.

Watis

[Lootman]

Today, yes. But last decade's texting on a 0-9 keypad is already totally defunct. By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

This is the key point. If you believe it will be voice dictation, chill. If not, get a copy of Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing, and a proper keyboard. Both of mine used it, and at least for now, touch typing is a huge bonus.

I second this. Having tried and failed with a few alternatives, Mavis Beacon worked for me.

Is it? What is this huge bonus?

I can see how saving a few milliseconds here and there saves some time. But personally I am more interested in relevance, insight and accuracy than speed or quantity of input.

[genou]

I second this. Having tried and failed with a few alternatives, Mavis Beacon worked for me.

Is it? What is this huge bonus?

I can see how saving a few milliseconds here and there saves some time. But personally I am more interested in relevance, insight and accuracy than speed or quantity of input.

The object is that using a keyboard, as a touch typist, is like speaking. Your fingers just do it without any conscious involvement. Then you spend your time and attention achieving the good stuff. 90%+ of the time is just quicker. Every now and then it means that your stream of thought is not paused while you hunt and peck. None of which is a reason not to review and polish. From another perspective, learning to walk beats being able to crawl.

[csearle]

Who types on a tablet anymore? I swype and it is about 10 times faster. C.

[jfgw]

The object is that using a keyboard, as a touch typist, is like speaking. Your fingers just do it without any conscious involvement. Then you spend your time and attention achieving the good stuff. 90%+ of the time is just quicker. Every now and then it means that your stream of thought is not paused while you hunt and peck. None of which is a reason not to review and polish. From another perspective, learning to walk beats being able to crawl.

I 100% second that.

I don't know how I would get on with speech recognition. I find that thoughts pass from my brain to my fingers more seamlessly than they do to my mouth. Also, my mouth has to keep stopping to inhale. I usually edit what I have written so any speech recognition software would have to accommodate this.


Julian F. G. W.

[9873210]

The point is to enter data with speed, accuracy and fluidity (so that the act of typing does not interfere with choosing your words.) It's not racewalking. Despite what Sister Ghenghis Attila thought there are no style points. Anyway the good sister had a fit when they added zero and one keys and has not been seen since.

Classic touch typing on a querty keyboard is a decent method of data entry. But it was designed around 19th century mechanical limitations. Better methods are possible. If somebody uses a Dvorak keyboard, or hits 'y' with the wrong hand, or swipes, or uses two thumbs, or uses assistance like predictive text entry and they are fast and accurate and fluid, there are no style points.

However if somebody wants to use speech recognition in a shared space they should be sent to visit the soul of the good Sister.

[vrdiver]

Having been schooled when typing pools were "a thing" and managers dictated to secretaries (including their emails, when email first came out), and having spent my career first as a programmer and after, wedded to a keyboard one way or another, I still type using two fingers and a thumb. I probably should have learned to touch type, but it never seemed to be an issue.

These days it's even less of an issue, with virtual keypads, predictive text and voice recognition.

Personally, I'd be more concerned about what my child was typing than how.

VRD

[AF62]

By the time Loup's 10yo is in employment I suspect she'll be dictating to a perfect voice recognition system, and she'll wonder why anyone ever bothered with keyboards.

Having worked in an office next to someone who had to use speech recognition software to type, I can tell you it is #*&%^S annoying; far more distracting than people having a conversation nearby and far more irritating than listening to one sided phone conversations on the train.

[gryffron]

Having worked in an office next to someone who had to use speech recognition software to type, I can tell you it is #*&%^S annoying; far more distracting than people having a conversation nearby and far more irritating than listening to one sided phone conversations on the train.

Yeah, but that's because current speech recognition software is rubbish.
YOU - HAVE - TO -SPEAK - VERY - SLOW - LY - COMMA - LOUD - LY - AND - CLEAR - LY - STOP
When it gets better it will be no different to a normal conversation. Indeed, use a throat mic you'll barely need to make a sound.

Though I still think some jobs will be typing. Because if you're good at it it's faster! Must confess, it's a thing I wish I'd learnt to do properly (computer programmer)

[Arborbridge]

Having worked in an office next to someone who had to use speech recognition software to type, I can tell you it is #*&%^S annoying; far more distracting than people having a conversation nearby and far more irritating than listening to one sided phone conversations on the train.

Yeah, but that's because current speech recognition software is rubbish.
YOU - HAVE - TO -SPEAK - VERY - SLOW - LY - COMMA - LOUD - LY - AND - CLEAR - LY - STOP
When it gets better it will be no different to a normal conversation. Indeed, use a throat mic you'll barely need to make a sound.

Though I still think some jobs will be typing. Because if you're good at it it's faster! Must confess, it's a thing I wish I'd learnt to do properly (computer programmer)

Maybe having to speak properly for speech recognition software will start a habit so that people who are slightly hard of hearing can join in conversations once more. Most of my children and grandchildren mumble worse than the BBC production of Jamaica Inn.