Donate to Remove ads

Got a credit card? use our Credit Card & Finance Calculators

Thanks to johnstevens77,Bhoddhisatva,scotia,Anonymous,Cornytiv34, for Donating to support the site

India variant

The home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
Forum rules
This is the home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
zico
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 2139
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 12:12 pm
Has thanked: 1074 times
Been thanked: 1086 times

Re: India variant

#413363

Postby zico » May 19th, 2021, 10:13 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:
Lootman wrote:
I'd settle for guidelines that are clear. Right now we are allowed to travel to "amber" countries but then the government is suggesting that we shouldn't do that. Surely it is either deemed (mostly) safe or it is not? And yet we are receiving mixed signals.

I am choosing to regard the situation as merely an "advisory" i.e. you go at your own risk and maybe not all provisions of your travel insurance will hold up. But I really don't know.

Taking a trip to amberland next week and confused.


I do agree that the current guidance on some of the available travel options are unclear, confused and unhelpful at the moment, and it's disappointing that they're not more sensibly aligned.

My post earlier wasn't for one minute trying to suggest that everything is, and has been, fine with the situation that we're in and the good and bad steps we've made to get where we are today - I was simply trying to convey the difficulty in trying to gather a good, sensible, working consensus from all of the conflicting information that they must be having to deal with at any given time on the medical, scientific, political, and social aspects that often seem to come into conflict with each other much of the time over this issue, and especially now, at a time when quite diametric pressures on many of those fronts are coming to the fore...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess


I thought it would be interesting to take a look back at what fellow Lemonfoolers were saying a year ago - the earliest I could find were in the "No Statistics" topic. A couple of people were saying "why can't we just get it over with quickly" but a lot more people were explaining why that wouldn't work and also saying "we need to delay infections as quickly as possible, because the earlier we act, the more lives will be saved".

Obviously, there's a huge difference between someone thinking drastic action needs to be taken, and being the person authorising the entire country to close down, but even back last March (so without hindsight) the course of action proposed by many reasonably intelligent non-epidemiologists on these boards would have put the UK in a far better place than what we've had over the past 14 months.

I still think the logical course is to hope for the best, but prepare for the worst - which in practical terms means being overly cautious when a new threat emerges until you know exactly what level of risk you're facing. A true "data not dates" approach would have avoided the government problem being seen in terms of "will they break their 21st June promise?" and would have freed up the government to make the rational best decisions.

The new problem that the government does now have is that for the first time, there is now a potential trade-off between health and economy (assuming the Indian variant isn't 50% more transmissible) because we can avoid another lockdown (which was never an option before).

Mike4
Lemon Half
Posts: 7085
Joined: November 24th, 2016, 3:29 am
Has thanked: 1637 times
Been thanked: 3793 times

Re: India variant

#413366

Postby Mike4 » May 19th, 2021, 10:25 pm

zico wrote:
Itsallaguess wrote:
Lootman wrote:
I'd settle for guidelines that are clear. Right now we are allowed to travel to "amber" countries but then the government is suggesting that we shouldn't do that. Surely it is either deemed (mostly) safe or it is not? And yet we are receiving mixed signals.

I am choosing to regard the situation as merely an "advisory" i.e. you go at your own risk and maybe not all provisions of your travel insurance will hold up. But I really don't know.

Taking a trip to amberland next week and confused.


I do agree that the current guidance on some of the available travel options are unclear, confused and unhelpful at the moment, and it's disappointing that they're not more sensibly aligned.

My post earlier wasn't for one minute trying to suggest that everything is, and has been, fine with the situation that we're in and the good and bad steps we've made to get where we are today - I was simply trying to convey the difficulty in trying to gather a good, sensible, working consensus from all of the conflicting information that they must be having to deal with at any given time on the medical, scientific, political, and social aspects that often seem to come into conflict with each other much of the time over this issue, and especially now, at a time when quite diametric pressures on many of those fronts are coming to the fore...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess


I thought it would be interesting to take a look back at what fellow Lemonfoolers were saying a year ago - the earliest I could find were in the "No Statistics" topic. A couple of people were saying "why can't we just get it over with quickly" but a lot more people were explaining why that wouldn't work and also saying "we need to delay infections as quickly as possible, because the earlier we act, the more lives will be saved".

Obviously, there's a huge difference between someone thinking drastic action needs to be taken, and being the person authorising the entire country to close down, but even back last March (so without hindsight) the course of action proposed by many reasonably intelligent non-epidemiologists on these boards would have put the UK in a far better place than what we've had over the past 14 months.

I still think the logical course is to hope for the best, but prepare for the worst - which in practical terms means being overly cautious when a new threat emerges until you know exactly what level of risk you're facing. A true "data not dates" approach would have avoided the government problem being seen in terms of "will they break their 21st June promise?" and would have freed up the government to make the rational best decisions.

The new problem that the government does now have is that for the first time, there is now a potential trade-off between health and economy (assuming the Indian variant isn't 50% more transmissible) because we can avoid another lockdown (which was never an option before).


I'm not sure when I first started posting this chart on here but the bloke I got it from was saying back in March 2020, this is 100 year old knowledge in the profession of public health. But our politicians reject it so they are gonna have to re-learn it over.

And so it is coming to pass, glacially slowly.

Image

servodude
Lemon Half
Posts: 8271
Joined: November 8th, 2016, 5:56 am
Has thanked: 4435 times
Been thanked: 3564 times

Re: India variant

#413375

Postby servodude » May 19th, 2021, 11:10 pm

Mike4 wrote:I'm not sure when I first started posting this chart on here


and it always makes me wonder where you found a copy of the "Hanes Manual for Pandemics" ;)

Mike4 wrote:
dealtn wrote:
Mike4 wrote:It appears to me that to avoid criticism that they over-react, our government consistently under-reacts.


How do you spot the "under reactions" by the authorities that don't result in any visible rise in Covid issues?

Very easy to fall into confirmation bias traps in such thinking.


If an 'under reaction' works, it is by definition not an under reaction.


One of the first things I posted about this feking virus was:

servodude wrote:you can only really know if you haven't done enough with something like this


which actually isn't that an unusual situation to be in

very few ever notice how much margin things have

you don't find many people wondering about whether the plane they are in was built too safely or if a bridge was made too strong
- but they do notice when things crash
- and it is unlikely that their response would be "ah but that other plane would have crashed eventually" ;)

- sd

Lootman
The full Lemon
Posts: 18681
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 3:58 pm
Has thanked: 628 times
Been thanked: 6563 times

Re: India variant

#413377

Postby Lootman » May 19th, 2021, 11:16 pm

servodude wrote:you don't find many people wondering about whether the plane they are in was built too safely or if a bridge was made too strong
- but they do notice when things crash

But that is exactly the problem. People over-rate the downside and under-rate the upside.

So that plane could be made 10 times safer if you are willing to pay 10 times the price to fly to Paris. But you aren't. You'd prefer a 39 quid fare and a 99.999% safety factor, over a 390 quid fare and a 99.9999% safety factor.

For any event X, those who are disadvantaged by the change will whine, and those who benefit won't realise it. Not a rational basis for policy or change.

9873210
Lemon Slice
Posts: 986
Joined: December 9th, 2016, 6:44 am
Has thanked: 226 times
Been thanked: 296 times

Re: India variant

#413383

Postby 9873210 » May 19th, 2021, 11:45 pm

Mike4 wrote:Gold Standard Pandemic Approach


So a medieval relic that caused a series of booms and busts, limited economic growth, and did no end of harm until we finally got rid of it in the middle of the 20th century.

Do Austrian economists call gold "the coughs and sneezes standard of money"?

:lol:

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#414091

Postby Itsallaguess » May 22nd, 2021, 9:55 am

Some encouraging news from this morning -

Two doses from either the Astrazeneca or the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine are 80 per cent effective in preventing infection from the Indian variant, a new Government study has found.

Data published by Public Health England also revealed that the two doses provides 87 per cent protection from the Kent variant discovered earlier this year.

The study's findings were presented to a meeting of the Government’s New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (Nervtag).


Source - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-news-covid-yorkshire-india-variant-vaccine-lockdown/

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

zico
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 2139
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 12:12 pm
Has thanked: 1074 times
Been thanked: 1086 times

Re: India variant

#414406

Postby zico » May 23rd, 2021, 2:26 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:Some encouraging news from this morning -

Two doses from either the Astrazeneca or the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine are 80 per cent effective in preventing infection from the Indian variant, a new Government study has found.

Data published by Public Health England also revealed that the two doses provides 87 per cent protection from the Kent variant discovered earlier this year.

The study's findings were presented to a meeting of the Government’s New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (Nervtag).


Source - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/global-health/science-and-disease/coronavirus-news-covid-yorkshire-india-variant-vaccine-lockdown/
Itsallaguess


First sentence of the Telegraph's quote appears to me to be seriously misleading. I've linked below to the government summary of the study, and also to the study itself (Table 2 appears to be the most important, and most of my numbers below are from that).

Study says that after 2 doses, Pfizer has 88% protection from infection, AstraZeneca has 60% - which is not 87%. Maybe it's because AZ 2nd jabs are more recent, but we don't know. Could the study have controlled for this, to give a definite answer? I'd have thought so, surprised it hasn't.

Actually, the study doesn't even tell us that. To be much more accurate, study says Pfizer's 88% figure could be in the range (78%-93%) with 95% confidence. (That's useful, because even 78% is a pretty good figure). However, AstraZeneca 60% figure could anywhere between (29%-73%) - if the true figure is anywhere near 29%, that's seriously bad news. There are only 13 and 14 cases respectively of Pfizer and AZ double-jabbees testing positive - they are pretty low numbers, so very early days - but definitely too early to say this is good news.

Study excludes children under 16 years old - no reason given. Why remove an age group entirely, particularly when data is in short supply?

So, actually looking at the study, what does it say (as opposed to what the Telegraph tells us)?

For people with one jab (i.e. virtually everyone under 50 years old) both vaccines are 33% effective. Pfizer range is (8%-51%) AZ range is (19%-44%).
Corresponding figures for Kent variant - Pfizer 49%(43%-55%) AZ 51% (47-55%).

For fully vaccinated (2-jab) people, the gap appears to be a lot smaller. Pfizer 93% for Kent against 87% for Indian.
Oxford 66% (54%-75%) for Kent against 60% (29%-77%).

The important issue is whether Indian variant is more transmissble, and if so, by how much. This study doesn't address this.


https://www.gov.uk/government/news/vacc ... er-2-doses

https://khub.net/documents/135939561/43 ... 664107ac42

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#414410

Postby Itsallaguess » May 23rd, 2021, 2:44 pm

zico wrote:
There are only 13 and 14 cases respectively of Pfizer and AZ double-jabbees testing positive [with the Indian variant] - they are pretty low numbers, so very early days - but definitely too early to say this is good news.


Well I'm not quite sure how to respond to that, other than to simply say that I'm glad that a different level of pragmatism is being seen by those in charge of balancing the wider economic and societal risks with the very low levels of hospitalisations and deaths actually being seen with this new Indian variant...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

Mike4
Lemon Half
Posts: 7085
Joined: November 24th, 2016, 3:29 am
Has thanked: 1637 times
Been thanked: 3793 times

Re: India variant

#414415

Postby Mike4 » May 23rd, 2021, 3:08 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:
zico wrote:
There are only 13 and 14 cases respectively of Pfizer and AZ double-jabbees testing positive [with the Indian variant] - they are pretty low numbers, so very early days - but definitely too early to say this is good news.


Well I'm not quite sure how to respond to that, other than to simply say that I'm glad that a different level of pragmatism is being seen by those in charge of balancing the wider economic and societal risks with the very low levels of hospitalisations and deaths actually being seen with this new Indian variant...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess


Yes its a curious anomaly isn't it, this (very welcome) decoupling of deaths from infections we are now seeing.

An anomaly given the emerging data showing how low the protection the (widely used) AZ vaccine gives against the Indian variant, yet this Indian variant is causing hardly any hospitalisations and deaths.

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#414418

Postby Itsallaguess » May 23rd, 2021, 3:15 pm

Mike4 wrote:
Itsallaguess wrote:
zico wrote:
There are only 13 and 14 cases respectively of Pfizer and AZ double-jabbees testing positive [with the Indian variant] - they are pretty low numbers, so very early days - but definitely too early to say this is good news.


Well I'm not quite sure how to respond to that, other than to simply say that I'm glad that a different level of pragmatism is being seen by those in charge of balancing the wider economic and societal risks with the very low levels of hospitalisations and deaths actually being seen with this new Indian variant...


Yes its a curious anomaly isn't it, this (very welcome) decoupling of deaths from infections we are now seeing.

An anomaly given the emerging data showing how low the protection the (widely used) AZ vaccine gives against the Indian variant, yet this Indian variant is causing hardly any hospitalisations and deaths.


How much of an 'anomaly' is it though, and when you say 'low protection', do you mean the lower figures from a single-jab, because the figures for the double-jabs are fairly good, I would say...

Given that the majority of hospitalisations and deaths have historically been seen from the oldest cohorts and also those with the highest risk-factors, and given that those are precisely the areas prioritised by the first jabs, and hence the delivery of their second jabs too, then anyone surprised by the decoupling of infection-rates to hospitalisations and deaths might perhaps start by looking at their own views and assumptions, rather than the welcome but actually not overly surprising data currently being seen...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

murraypaul
Lemon Slice
Posts: 785
Joined: April 9th, 2021, 5:54 pm
Has thanked: 225 times
Been thanked: 265 times

Re: India variant

#414436

Postby murraypaul » May 23rd, 2021, 3:41 pm

There are two separate things going on.

Firstly, having had the vaccine, whether one dose or two, gives a reduced chance of contracting coronavirus.

Secondly, having had the vaccine reduces the seriousness of the symptoms if you do contract coronavirus.

So you might still have a ~65% chance of getting it after one dose of AZ, but that is less than a ~65% chance of getting seriously ill or dying, compared to having not been vaccinated.

zico
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 2139
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 12:12 pm
Has thanked: 1074 times
Been thanked: 1086 times

Re: India variant

#414440

Postby zico » May 23rd, 2021, 4:04 pm

The figures in this report are just about infections, it's much too soon to see reliable data about deaths.
We know that for every previous wave, there have been people saying a big rise of infections won't necessarily mean a big rise in deaths - and they have been wrong every previous time. This time they may actually be right, but we don't yet know.

It's true to say the vaccine protection %ages increase for more severe forms of the disease, which is very good news, and applies both to Kent and India variants.

UK problem now is that the India variant seems very likely to become dominant, and the vaccines will have somewhat weaker protective effects than against the Kent strain.

If it gets into the wider community, the following groups of people will be at risk of serious illness/death.
Unvaccinated people under 30 years old with health conditions.
Older people refusing to be vaccinated (no sympathy for these).
Older people who aren't allowed to be vaccinated because someone won't allow them.
Older people who for medical reasons can't take the vaccine.
Older people not protected because the vaccine doesn't work for them (Hopefully a very small percentage of people).

SAGE have said that if Phases 3 and 4 of the Road Map go ahead, then even with the vaccination rollout proceeding as planned, there could be a wave of hospitalisation and deaths similar to January if a new variant is more transmissible, and also somewhat vaccine-resistant.
Hopefully the deaths will be much lower than this, but is really it too early to say it will all be manageable.

murraypaul
Lemon Slice
Posts: 785
Joined: April 9th, 2021, 5:54 pm
Has thanked: 225 times
Been thanked: 265 times

Re: India variant

#414977

Postby murraypaul » May 25th, 2021, 1:04 pm

An outbreak in another area, quite distant from the current hotspots.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/surg ... -hampshire

Surge testing to be deployed in North East Hampshire

Working with the local authority, NHS Test and Trace is providing additional testing in areas across the Hart District, Rushmoor Borough and Surrey border.


Sort of/sort of not linked to an unnamed local school.

kempiejon
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 3488
Joined: November 5th, 2016, 10:30 am
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1145 times

Re: India variant

#415299

Postby kempiejon » May 26th, 2021, 1:53 pm

murraypaul wrote:An outbreak in another area, quite distant from the current hotspots.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/surg ... -hampshire

Surge testing to be deployed in North East Hampshire

Working with the local authority, NHS Test and Trace is providing additional testing in areas across the Hart District, Rushmoor Borough and Surrey border.


Sort of/sort of not linked to an unnamed local school.

Court Moor school Fleet and I thought there was another school but I can't find that article now
https://www.hampshirelive.news/news/ham ... ia-5442926

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#415813

Postby Itsallaguess » May 28th, 2021, 12:31 pm

Some encouraging data from Public Health England was released yesterday, and it tells us that between 1st Feb and 25th May, 5599 cases of the Indian variant had been detected in England, and 201 of those cases were associated with a visit to Hospital A&E.

Encouragingly, within those 201 A&E visits, just 5 people were reported to have had two vaccination doses, which equates to around 2.5% of those A&E visits being made by fully vaccinated individuals -

Image

Source - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/990177/Variants_of_Concern_VOC_Technical_Briefing_13_England.pdf

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

Julian
Lemon Quarter
Posts: 1385
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 9:58 am
Has thanked: 532 times
Been thanked: 676 times

Re: India variant

#415869

Postby Julian » May 28th, 2021, 3:35 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:Some encouraging data from Public Health England was released yesterday, and it tells us that between 1st Feb and 25th May, 5599 cases of the Indian variant had been detected in England, and 201 of those cases were associated with a visit to Hospital A&E.

Encouragingly, within those 201 A&E visits, just 5 people were reported to have had two vaccination doses, which equates to around 2.5% of those A&E visits being made by fully vaccinated individuals -

Image

Source - https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/990177/Variants_of_Concern_VOC_Technical_Briefing_13_England.pdf

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

Thanks. That's really encouraging and, for the benefit of others, that "source:" link goes to a 67 page report that has masses of extra detail.

As so often happens though, I'm left wishing for even more info. In particular I would love to know, of those 5 fully vaccinated people who still ended up visiting A&E and the 2 people who died (where those two groups might have a full or partial intersection), which vaccines were involved. If for instance all of those seriously affected had had the AZ vaccine and there were no fully vaccinated Pfizer people in the baddly-affected group I, as an AZ recipient, would find that a bit concerning. The numbers are of course low so one would not want to draw any statistically valid conclusions but I would at least be reassured to know that there wasn't a "clean sweep" for one vaccine or the other.

I also wish they had some data about how long after their second doses those badly affected presented at A&E and/or died. One possible explanation given in the May 24th PHE paper about the significantly lower efficacy against symptomatic B.1.617.2 infection after 2 doses seen for the AZ vaccine vs the Pfizer vaccine (59.8% for AZ vs 87.9% for Pfizer) was that the AZ vaccine needed longer after the 2nd dose to reach its full efficacy compared to the time needed by the Pfizer vaccine and that, due to the later start to the national AZ rollout, the cut-off date for the 24th May study might not have allowed sufficient time for many of the double-dosed AZ recipients to have gained full protection.

[ PHE vaccine efficacy paper is here: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 21257658v1 ]

Still, nit-picking aside I do like the quantity and quality of the data that is being put out and the overall picture does continue to look encouraging regarding the vaccine vs variants war.

- Julian

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#415875

Postby Itsallaguess » May 28th, 2021, 3:58 pm

Julian wrote:
Itsallaguess wrote:
Some encouraging data from Public Health England was released yesterday, and it tells us that between 1st Feb and 25th May, 5599 cases of the Indian variant had been detected in England, and 201 of those cases were associated with a visit to Hospital A&E.

Encouragingly, within those 201 A&E visits, just 5 people were reported to have had two vaccination doses, which equates to around 2.5% of those A&E visits being made by fully vaccinated individuals..


Still, nit-picking aside I do like the quantity and quality of the data that is being put out and the overall picture does continue to look encouraging regarding the vaccine vs variants war.


I agree Julian - this type of data being available at this time is very welcome, but like you, I'd also be keen to see even more granular data if possible, and specifically related to -

1. Ages of individuals

2. Related 'comorbidity' information

Those two data-sets often seem to be key drivers for the worst types of COVID-related outcomes, and if, for example, we were to potentially be able to see that both of those drivers may have been influential with those relatively small numbers of 'double-vaccinated hospitalisations', then it really would start to give some real confidence to large parts of the 'double-dosed' population who sit outside of those 'worst-outcome' spheres...

Overall though - encouraging news, and even if we have to put up with a short delay to the lifting of the June restrictions whilst we continue to vaccinate larger sections of the younger adults, it's starting to look like the medium term prognosis is much more encouraging than it was just a few short weeks ago when we only really had the data coming out of the largely un-vaccinated India to draw judgements from...

Cheers,

Itsallaguess

9873210
Lemon Slice
Posts: 986
Joined: December 9th, 2016, 6:44 am
Has thanked: 226 times
Been thanked: 296 times

Re: India variant

#415897

Postby 9873210 » May 28th, 2021, 5:00 pm

Itsallaguess wrote:Some encouraging data from Public Health England was released yesterday, and it tells us that between 1st Feb and 25th May, 5599 cases of the Indian variant had been detected in England, and 201 of those cases were associated with a visit to Hospital A&E.

Encouragingly, within those 201 A&E visits, just 5 people were reported to have had two vaccination doses, which equates to around 2.5% of those A&E visits being made by fully vaccinated individuals -

From 1st Feb to 25th May the fully vaccinated averaged 11% of the population*. Naively this suggests a 80% risk reductions. It's probably better than that since both fully vaccinated and exposure to the Indian variant are back end loaded. But you do need to consider the fraction of population that is fully vaccinated to draw any conclusions.

* using downloaded date from https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations. Fully vaccinated population was below 5% until March 26, and below 10% until April 9.

XFool
The full Lemon
Posts: 12636
Joined: November 8th, 2016, 7:21 pm
Been thanked: 2608 times

Re: India variant

#415901

Postby XFool » May 28th, 2021, 5:20 pm

Lootman wrote:
servodude wrote:you don't find many people wondering about whether the plane they are in was built too safely or if a bridge was made too strong
- but they do notice when things crash

But that is exactly the problem. People over-rate the downside and under-rate the upside.

Um... Being killed vs. not being killed? Doesn't sound that symmetrical a situation to me! Is not being killed really an "upside"? It might be for mountaineers and lion tamers, I suppose. But everyday people going about their everyday business?

Lootman wrote:So that plane could be made 10 times safer if you are willing to pay 10 times the price to fly to Paris.

Could it? Does it really work like that?

Itsallaguess
Lemon Half
Posts: 9129
Joined: November 4th, 2016, 1:16 pm
Has thanked: 4140 times
Been thanked: 10023 times

Re: India variant

#418032

Postby Itsallaguess » June 8th, 2021, 7:16 am

From the Telegraph this morning -

Just three people from those taken to hospital with the Indian Covid variant have been double vaccinated, the Health Secretary has revealed.

Matt Hancock told MPs that hospital cases were "broadly flat" and just three of the 126 people admitted with Covid from the Indian strain had received both doses of a vaccine. He went on to say 65 per cent of those who ended up in hospital with the Indian variant had not received a single jab.

"The jabs are working," he said. "The majority of people in hospital with Covid appear to be those who haven't had the vaccine at all."

He spoke as it was revealed that just 169 patients have been admitted to intensive care with Covid in the past month in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, equating to fewer than six cases per day.

The latest report from The Intensive Care National Audio and Research Centre (ICNARC) shows that the number of people needing critical care has fallen dramatically.

The new figures chime with comments from NHS leaders in variant hotspots who say that not only have services not been overwhelmed but also that patients are less sick, with only a small number now needing critical care.


https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/06/07/plunging-intensive-care-admissions-show-link-covid-cases-serious/

Cheers,

Itsallaguess


Return to “Coronavirus Discussions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests