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Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

The home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
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This is the home for all non-political Coronavirus (Covid-19) discussions on The Lemon Fool
AF62
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Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441402

Postby AF62 » September 11th, 2021, 8:51 am

As I will be travelling outside the UK in a few weeks time on separate trips to amber and green list countries, then being double jabbed I recognised I would be required to take a ‘Day 2’ test and provide evidence of booking that test to be taken after my return home on my Passenger Locator Form (PLF) which is submitted before returning to the UK.

So off to the government website to see the list of providers - https://www.gov.uk/find-travel-test-provider

Great, the government is showing lots of providers doing tests for £20.

Oh, hang on, that £20 test from 0001111Aaaa Medical (Fictional) Ltd (memories of the old Yellow Pages and the tricks used to get to the top of the listing) is only for a turn up in person test in some remote corner of the UK at some inconvenient time, but actually we have sold out anyway. So would you like to buy our full price £99 tests delivered to your home? Or they are selling 50 £20 tests a day (honest guv) but we are sold out. Or they are selling them to people called Zebbdia Zebbedy - You have a different name, well you need a full price test.

Then there are the companies who have been kicked off that list but are still selling tests because the only requirement of the test is it meets “minimum standards” (to quote the gov.uk webpage above) - but it doesn’t tell you what those minimum standards are…

And then you get to the issue that there are two groups of people; those that actually want to take a Day 2 test and find out the result, and those who simply want a code for the PLF to get through Border Control so want to pay the least they can for that code.

For that second group do I really believe that there is some ‘live’ check conducted by Border Force that the code entered onto the PLF has actually been issued by one of these (frankly dubious) providers, or that even entering a random set of letters and numbers will do. Do I believe that Border Force is actually checking after the event that everyone has actually received a test (either posted or turned up to a booking in the middle of nowhere) and then been provided with a result. Have I heard of a single traveller being prosecuted for ‘cheating the system’ by booking a test they don’t take or turn up to - given the complaints on Trustpilot about tests not being received, it would be a brave prosecutor who would charge someone for failing to take a test that hadn’t been posted by a supplier on the government approved list.

Or alternatively is this just ‘security theatre’ instigated by politicians with their only concern being appearance, overseen by naive and gullible civil servants, and exploited by the commercial sector who have the ear of the politicians who instigated it.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441408

Postby redsturgeon » September 11th, 2021, 9:39 am

AF62 wrote:As I will be travelling outside the UK in a few weeks time on separate trips to amber and green list countries, then being double jabbed I recognised I would be required to take a ‘Day 2’ test and provide evidence of booking that test to be taken after my return home on my Passenger Locator Form (PLF) which is submitted before returning to the UK.

So off to the government website to see the list of providers - https://www.gov.uk/find-travel-test-provider

Great, the government is showing lots of providers doing tests for £20.

Oh, hang on, that £20 test from 0001111Aaaa Medical (Fictional) Ltd (memories of the old Yellow Pages and the tricks used to get to the top of the listing) is only for a turn up in person test in some remote corner of the UK at some inconvenient time, but actually we have sold out anyway. So would you like to buy our full price £99 tests delivered to your home? Or they are selling 50 £20 tests a day (honest guv) but we are sold out. Or they are selling them to people called Zebbdia Zebbedy - You have a different name, well you need a full price test.

Then there are the companies who have been kicked off that list but are still selling tests because the only requirement of the test is it meets “minimum standards” (to quote the gov.uk webpage above) - but it doesn’t tell you what those minimum standards are…

And then you get to the issue that there are two groups of people; those that actually want to take a Day 2 test and find out the result, and those who simply want a code for the PLF to get through Border Control so want to pay the least they can for that code.

For that second group do I really believe that there is some ‘live’ check conducted by Border Force that the code entered onto the PLF has actually been issued by one of these (frankly dubious) providers, or that even entering a random set of letters and numbers will do. Do I believe that Border Force is actually checking after the event that everyone has actually received a test (either posted or turned up to a booking in the middle of nowhere) and then been provided with a result. Have I heard of a single traveller being prosecuted for ‘cheating the system’ by booking a test they don’t take or turn up to - given the complaints on Trustpilot about tests not being received, it would be a brave prosecutor who would charge someone for failing to take a test that hadn’t been posted by a supplier on the government approved list.

Or alternatively is this just ‘security theatre’ instigated by politicians with their only concern being appearance, overseen by naive and gullible civil servants, and exploited by the commercial sector who have the ear of the politicians who instigated it.


This is a very good summary of the system as it stands, speaking as the part owner of a company providing these tests. We had to go through an accreditation process by UKAS that cost us £10,000 to meet. We were one of the first companies to complete this process back in June but we only received the official certification a week ago. In the meantime many of the companies on the list have never even bothered to go through the process and are only now being taken off the list. As for tests being available at £20, we actual have to pay more than twice as much as this wholesale for our tests and then have to add VAT on top when we sell them.

You are correct that some client only want the PLF number and don't really care if they receive the test or not.rrrrr

Daily we have people phoning up desperate for tests when their cheap provider has failed to deliver, they say they have been phoning around. and we are the first to pick up the phone...this may be at 7pm on a Saturday...then they complain at our prices.

Your title is accurate.

John

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441416

Postby seagles » September 11th, 2021, 10:13 am

I agree it is a "minefield" out there. We went to Portugal back in June and were lucky it was with Tui and their provider, Chronomics, were really good especially when the "rules" changed. Since then my daughter has used Expert Medical who delivered the day 2 test but took 5 days to give a result. My housekeeper/lodger and family had there day 2 tests recently and used the Royal Mail 24 hour service (cannot remember the company thy used but it cost £69), took 3 days for it to be delivered to the Clinic, spent over 24 hours in Swindon? My daughter is currently in Dubai and has her day 2 with Randox, so we shall see what happens with her "drop box" experience. I am off in a couple of weeks and am likely to be using Randox, purely as they are about to open a drop in centre at the Radisson Blue at Heathrow for £50. If I used their "drop box" I would either need to drive 35 minutes to a service station on the M4 or Heathrow for £43. Expert Medical no longer seem to provide any tests and are "under investigation".

There are some great places out there, my daughter and partner used a company in Victoria for their outgoing PCR test cost £65. There are drop in centres near me (ok 30 to 50 minute drive away) for £69. I have only tried to book with Randox and there was loads of appointments available, but then again they have only just put Heathrow on their web-site so not sure how long tha is going to be true.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441420

Postby redsturgeon » September 11th, 2021, 10:31 am

We deal with Randox and I am at The Radisson Blu site most days, delivering same day PCR tests for our customers. One thing to watch is the Randox test are not fully compliant with all countries requirements for their PCR tests, so it is worth double checking they are OK.

We tend to use Oncologica in Cambridge for our next day service as they have proved more consistent with their speed of results. This may change with the Randox facility they seem to be building at Heathrow.

John

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441425

Postby seagles » September 11th, 2021, 11:06 am

redsturgeon wrote:We deal with Randox and I am at The Radisson Blu site most days, delivering same day PCR tests for our customers. One thing to watch is the Randox test are not fully compliant with all countries requirements for their PCR tests, so it is worth double checking they are OK.

We tend to use Oncologica in Cambridge for our next day service as they have proved more consistent with their speed of results. This may change with the Randox facility they seem to be building at Heathrow.

John


I think that is why my daughter used the place in Victoria for her outbound test. I have heard good things about Oncologica and their speed of response. I can get to the Radisson in about 40 minutes, in fact will be driving past on my Heathrow pick-up on Monday when doing my "father's taxi" trip.

Will look out for you in October then :evil: at the Randox Radisson test site.....

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441427

Postby redsturgeon » September 11th, 2021, 11:12 am

seagles wrote:
redsturgeon wrote:We deal with Randox and I am at The Radisson Blu site most days, delivering same day PCR tests for our customers. One thing to watch is the Randox test are not fully compliant with all countries requirements for their PCR tests, so it is worth double checking they are OK.

We tend to use Oncologica in Cambridge for our next day service as they have proved more consistent with their speed of results. This may change with the Randox facility they seem to be building at Heathrow.

John


I think that is why my daughter used the place in Victoria for her outbound test. I have heard good things about Oncologica and their speed of response. I can get to the Radisson in about 40 minutes, in fact will be driving past on my Heathrow pick-up on Monday when doing my "father's taxi" trip.

Will look out for you in October then :evil: at the Randox Radisson test site.....


Quick tip for getting into the Radisson car park, turn left at the McDonalds traffic lights on Bath road, round the back of the Novotel and at the second roundabout turn left to the iron gates to the Radisson car park, they will open automatically. Easier than going via the front of the hotel especially at the weekend when the Bath Road get very congested for some reason.

John

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441499

Postby AF62 » September 11th, 2021, 6:22 pm

seagles wrote:...Since then my daughter has used Expert Medical who delivered the day 2 test but took 5 days to give a result. ... Expert Medical no longer seem to provide any tests and are "under investigation".


No, Expert Medical were removed from the government approved list published on that link on gov.uk I provided, but are still selling tests for £28 (and providing the code for the PLF which is all a lot of people want) as the gov.uk website says that the testing company doesn't need to be on the list, just that its test meets “minimum standards” but it doesn’t tell you what those minimum standards are…

It is hilarious looking at the Trustpilot reviews of Expert Medical, those who just want a code for the PLF - 5 stars, those who actually want a test and then the results - one star.

And then there are the rumours that the government is considering changing the rules again; merging the green and amber list for double jabbed, and also removing the 'Day 2' test requirement for double jabbed.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441503

Postby stockton » September 11th, 2021, 7:11 pm

Rather more farcical is that the tests require an internet connection if they are to be used. I am still wondering whether I can reclaim the money paid as, in our case, the tests were obviously not "fit for purpose".

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441509

Postby Lootman » September 11th, 2021, 8:02 pm

At least if you are returning to Heathrow T5 then there is Arrivals testing there that meets the Day 2 standard. There is also a facility at Paddington station if you are taking the Heathrow Express.

The Day Two test can be done at any point between arrival and Day Two, so they meet the criterion without having to futz about with kits being sent in the post. When I had one there a couple of weeks ago the cost was 80 quid and the results were available in about 24 hours. (I believe the departure tests results are available in 15 minutes but I have not done that yet - probably will next month).

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441515

Postby Dod101 » September 11th, 2021, 8:33 pm

I have no sympathy for people who have problems being tested unless they really need to travel. Just don't travel. Has that not occurred to anyone? I have no problems. I might be a bit bored at times but so what?

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441536

Postby AF62 » September 11th, 2021, 10:38 pm

Dod101 wrote:I have no sympathy for people who have problems being tested unless they really need to travel. Just don't travel. Has that not occurred to anyone? I have no problems. I might be a bit bored at times but so what?

Dod


There is no problem being tested.

If people want to be tested properly then it is easy to buy a test that will do that and will deliver the results promptly. It will cost you thought as these tests are not cheap.

Alternatively if you don’t want to even bother taking a test but just want to get through Border Control then it is equally easy to just get a code for the PLF. The codes are cheap and whether the accompanying test (if it ever arrives is any good) is irrelevant.

What is absurd is why the government has allowed this to develop; either test people or don’t. But don’t line the pockets of the dubious companies who are cheating the system.

As for not travelling - your choice, but not mine.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441544

Postby Lootman » September 12th, 2021, 12:12 am

AF62 wrote:Alternatively if you don’t want to even bother taking a test but just want to get through Border Control then it is equally easy to just get a code for the PLF. The codes are cheap and whether the accompanying test (if it ever arrives is any good) is irrelevant.

Back when you had to self-isolate for ten days upon your return to the UK, there was some point to actually doing the tests and getting the results. Moreover someone would ring me every day checking that I have done the tests and that I was isolating. So if I had not done the tests that might have been noticed, which would trigger some further action, possibly.

But now there is no self-quarantine I cannot imagine there is any material downside to not doing the test. The government simply relies on you doing so voluntarily. And since you have already paid for the test, I suspect that most people will still do it.

And in three arrivals into Heathrow in the last year, I was never once asked for my PLF, although last time the check-in desk at the airport I was flying in from did ask to see it.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441646

Postby Julian » September 12th, 2021, 2:35 pm

Quite a lot of reports in the papers yesterday and today about rumours that the UK will be dropping the requirement for negative PCR tests when returning to the UK from green and amber list countries with lateral flow tests replacing PCR day 2 tests, e.g. this report that wasn't behind a paywall - https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/uk-c ... 54873.html

The rumours are that the requirement will be scrapped in time for school half term.

The linked report also says "Covid tests before leaving Britain also may be dropped". I don't really understand that bit because isn't that down to the entry requirements of the country that one is travelling to(*) so how can that be something that Johnson/Javid/Sunak can meaningfully discuss beyond idle "I wish country X would allow UK citizens in without testing" conversations? I suppose they can try and exert influence but surely they have no actual control of that half of the equation?

- Julian

(*) Come to think of it, are negative test requirements also down to airline restrictions in some cases or do some/most/all airlines simply enforce the restrictions of the country that a particular flight is going to, e.g. if the destination country requires a negative PCR test then the airline will check that a traveller has the necessary paperwork before allowing him/her to board but if there are no negative-test-for-entry requirements at the destination then some/most/all airlines will not require a negative test result before allowing a passenger to board?

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441654

Postby Lootman » September 12th, 2021, 2:53 pm

Julian wrote:are negative test requirements also down to airline restrictions in some cases or do some/most/all airlines simply enforce the restrictions of the country that a particular flight is going to, e.g. if the destination country requires a negative PCR test then the airline will check that a traveller has the necessary paperwork before allowing him/her to board but if there are no negative-test-for-entry requirements at the destination then some/most/all airlines will not require a negative test result before allowing a passenger to board?

The answer is both.

If the destination country has a requirement then the airline will be asked to check that people boarding the flight meet that requirement. The airline might be fined for allowing on board someone who will be rejected at the destination airport. So for example BA checked my test result when I flew to the US last month. When checking in for the return flight, BA asked to see both my test result and my PLF, for valid entry to the UK.

But an airline can also impose extra rules. For instance Qantas plans to resume long-haul flights at the end of 2021, and will require all passengers to show proof of being double vaccinated. That is regardless of what the destination country requires.

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Re: Travel - Day 2 tests - A farce

#441952

Postby terminal7 » September 13th, 2021, 5:48 pm

My OH and I have been away 3 times to France in the last 2/3 months. This has involved 2 sets of 2/5/8 day tests and 1 set of 2 day tests on the respective returns. As we all know no tests booked - no reference code - PLF will not complete. The totality of these tests cost circa £1.2k. Clearly we travelled fully aware of the attendant costs.

Out of 8 tests in total - some by attendance at what could be laughingly called a 'clinic' - some by post - we received the 'results' in 5 cases. Despite chasing the outstanding 3 cases, we have never received either an actual response (automatic responses saying we will be in touch excluded) to the follow-up enquiries or indeed the results. In one instance of receiving a test result - I actually received some 15 emails repeating the same result. In another instance of the attached certificate was blank though signed. In effect we had under 50% of the results we paid for.

T7


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