1nvest wrote:GoSeigen wrote:1nvest wrote:GoSeigen wrote:1nvest wrote:Generally around only 20% of the population voted for the government in office. A minority. 80% didn't vote for it. But that works for some. End of.
Complete fallacy. Dude evidently believes babies should also be voting. And that since 99.9% of population didn't vote in a company's general meeting its decisions are taken by the minority and so undemocratic. Bizarre. "End of."
GS
Rather pathetic [...]
Hah! What are your standards for pathetic then? Wouldn't it be rather pathetic not to recognise that there is a defined electorate? Wouldn't it be pathetic to expect all of them to vote and that if some didn't an election is invalidated? Wouldn't it be pathetic for a country to decide to leave the EU on the votes of fewer than 25% of the population?
GS
Personally I opine that matters involving constitutional changes should require a distinct majority, not 50/50 first past post, perhaps 60/40 as a minimum. And of proportional representation where if 7M vote LD, 8M vote Con, they don't end up with LD having 40 MP's whilst Con have 160 MP's. And yes, its pathetic that the MP's that as-is define the rules permit such existing rules. Leading to the likes of Scotland and its SNP quest to repeatedly vote in order to secure just one vote above the 50% of voters line, win very marginally just once out of many attempts in order to secure the 'desired' outcome. Less pathetic rules would favour PR, and for Brexit/Scottish Independence to require a more substantial backing by the population (and in which case the UK would never have even joined the EU in the first place, instead of being dragged in via a PM who was bribed with a yacht to do so).
There had never been a UK wide referendum on anything before 1975 (and the only countrywide referendum - the NI border poll - was held in 1973 after Heath had taken us into the EEC).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Northern_Ireland_border_pollThe Northern Ireland border poll was a referendum held in Northern Ireland on 8 March 1973 on whether Northern Ireland should remain part of the United Kingdom or join with the Republic of Ireland to form a united Ireland. It was the first time that a major referendum had been held in any region of the United Kingdom. Hence it wasn't surprising that we went in without a referendum as we had never had such referendums and it was standard practice for parliament to make such decisions which it had in the vote of October 1971 which voted to join by 356 votes to 244 after 6 days of debate. Further debate and more votes in favour were then held as the legislation required to enact entry was passed eg the European Community Act 1972.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/oct/28/house-of-commons-approve-uk-entry-into-europe-archive-1971A debate would take place across six days with the Commons eventually voting in favour of entry by 356 votes to 244.
The 1975 referendum on whether to stay in the EEC resulted in a victory for remaining which comfortably exceeds your 60/40 of those voting although that wasn't a requirement.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1975_United_Kingdom_European_Communities_membership_referendumAnd, also incidentally, exceeds the requirement in the 1979 Scottish and Welsh devolution referendums which are the only ones to have actually required something more than a simple majority by requiring the support of more than 40% of registered voters.
The turn out of the 1975 election being 64.62% means that the percentage of the whole electorate voting in favour was 43.44%.
In contrast the 2016 referendum would have failed on both your 60:40 criteria and the 1979 referendum criteria.
As to the bribery with a Yacht I believe this relates to the money he received from winning the Charlemagne prize
https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1130623/eu-news-brexit-deal-theresa-may-resign-conservative-leader-edward-heath-eec-sptAccording to 1990 book “Treason at Maastricht” by author Rodney Atkinson and political activist Norris McWhirter, Mr Heath received £75,000 as part of his prize.
In today’s money that equates to around £1.5million.
The book says: "[Mr Heath] certainly benefited, after having signed away British sovereignty in 1972, from the £75,000 Charlemagne Prize – presented by the German city of Aachen – for those who have done most for the construction of the European State.”The problem is that Heath received the Charlemagne prize in 1963 almost a decade before we joined the EEC and even the Telegraph in its obituary for him admits the prize was only £446. The recipient in 1972 being the then Labour politician Roy Jenkins.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlemagne_PrizeSir Edward Heath, who died yesterday aged 89, achieved his great ambition ... He was awarded the Charlemagne Prize; and put the £446 bounty...(I've exceeded my free articles so can't read the rest but from other sources he put the £446 towards a Steinway grand piano).
The first of Ted Heath's "Morning Cloud" Yachts wasn't bought until 1969
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morning_Cloud